Can Anybody Else Verify This???

Tigger said:
Police in the Boston suburbs were giving Narcan IM in the late 90s in a DOH program. I think we sometimes forget that opiate "epidemics" are not a new phenomenon.
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Exactly. The thing that has changed, at least up here, is we're seeing a lot more heroin cut with fentanyl. We always know when a batch arrives in town, the users start dropping like flies.
 
Tigger said:
Police in the Boston suburbs were giving Narcan IM in the late 90s in a DOH program. I think we sometimes forget that opiate "epidemics" are not a new phenomenon.
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Yeah, the South Shore pretty much pioneered the White People Opioid Epidemic. I thought it was IN, though. They might have switched over when the atomizer devices became more common and someone realized that cops and needles are not a natural mix. I'm told part of the training for these departments is explaining that :"narcotic" is not a useful category and Narcan doesn't reverse every drug.

Anyway, as someone who works in a couple of the aforementioned suburbs, there can't be enough Narcan in the community. Give it out at Dunkies. Put in in every public bathroom. Cropdust with it.
Whatever leads to fewer people being dead, because I don't like finding people dead and it's sort of my job to help people not die. I'm really not sure what part of that people are opposed to.
 
It's the whole ego thing. "I'M the hero here!" rings a bell. EMS assuming other people don't know how to stab someone with a needle and press down - as if it's some sort of incredibly complex medical procedure that ONLY licensed people could ever use or get.

It'd be good if people got over themselves. ;)
 
bcemr said:
It's the whole ego thing. "I'M the hero here!" rings a bell. EMS assuming other people don't know how to stab someone with a needle and press down - as if it's some sort of incredibly complex medical procedure that ONLY licensed people could ever use or get.

It'd be good if people got over themselves. ;)
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It seems as if the majority of the Narcan is sold with a MAD to avoid sharps.
 
Where I used to work (8 years ago) we had OD patients maybe once a month; and a fatal one maybe once a quarter.
Now they are using Narcan more than D-50, 2 or 3 times a week per truck on busy trucks; and any public use to save lives is a GREAT thing.
 
Meursault said:
Yeah, the South Shore pretty much pioneered the White People Opioid Epidemic. I thought it was IN, though. They might have switched over when the atomizer devices became more common and someone realized that cops and needles are not a natural mix. I'm told part of the training for these departments is explaining that :"narcotic" is not a useful category and Narcan doesn't reverse every drug.

Anyway, as someone who works in a couple of the aforementioned suburbs, there can't be enough Narcan in the community. Give it out at Dunkies. Put in in every public bathroom. Cropdust with it.
Whatever leads to fewer people being dead, because I don't like finding people dead and it's sort of my job to help people not die. I'm really not sure what part of that people are opposed to.
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I can't find the info anymore since the explosion of articles about public use, but suffice to say it's been around a while. I think you're right, I don't think IN existed more than 10 years ago really.
 
Remi said:
So you'd rather someone potentially die if it might mean "skipping punishment"? How very compassionate and non-judgemental of you.
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Really... your misinterpreting the statement, you think if i didn't care about the lives and safety of others I would run with a squad?
 
Mills2297 said:
Really... your misinterpreting the statement, you think if i didn't care about the lives and safety of others I would run with a squad?
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Theres a lot of reasons people do this, that might not even include helping people.
 
Mills2297 said:
Really... your misinterpreting the statement, you think if i didn't care about the lives and safety of others I would run with a squad?
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The statement in question was:
Mills2297 said:
its a good resource to have like EMS wise but for your everyday junkie to have a way out in case like PD comes or there friend OD's seems like its kind of there way of skipping punishment...
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I don't see any way of interpreting this statement as meaning anything other than the benefits of OTC narcan might be outweighed by the fact that it could help junkies "skip punishment".

How did I misinterpret?

P.S. Most folks who "run with a squad" do it for reasons other than the lives and safety of others.
 
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Tigger said:
I don't understand all the EMS outrage (not here) regarding public use Narcan. It's been around in Massachusetts for 20 years. It isn't a safety net, it's a way for the loved one's of addicts to potentially prevent their death. Can't really send a dead person to rehab now can we?
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I guess i objected to the widespread use of narcan because of the total lack of training on this stuff. I am coming from a state that has epi autoinjectors in schools, govt offices, beaches, pine trees, ect and ive been on more misfired epi pen calls then actual anaphylaxis calls. SO it was a reactionary "oh not this again" when it first came out. I pictured us going for an OD and now having an OD and a gy with an inch long needle stuck in his finger. I have also seen our 'professional" LEOs deploy IN Narcan is some of the weirdest possible ways. My last OD, the cop put the whole thing together the right way, then proceeded to just spray the narcan on the patients face.
 
Mills2297 said:
Really... your misinterpreting the statement, you think if i didn't care about the lives and safety of others I would run with a squad?
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I don't think anyone misunderstood you. You were very clear with what you said - you'd rather punish people for OD. It's fine - people have a right to their opinions.
 
Bullets said:
I guess i objected to the widespread use of narcan because of the total lack of training on this stuff. I am coming from a state that has epi autoinjectors in schools, govt offices, beaches, pine trees, ect and ive been on more misfired epi pen calls then actual anaphylaxis calls. SO it was a reactionary "oh not this again" when it first came out. I pictured us going for an OD and now having an OD and a gy with an inch long needle stuck in his finger. I have also seen our 'professional" LEOs deploy IN Narcan is some of the weirdest possible ways. My last OD, the cop put the whole thing together the right way, then proceeded to just spray the narcan on the patients face.
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Most of our cops out here have it. Have to yet to see or hear of any issues. The subpar training in your area does not negate its practicality.
 
Tigger said:
Most of our cops out here have it. Have to yet to see or hear of any issues. The subpar training in your area does not negate its practicality.
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The police here have it too. Haven't heard of any issues here either.
 
MonkeyArrow said:
It does in his area.
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If we based the success of interventions by only looking at small areas...oh wait we wouldn't do that.

Saying that you don't support something because it isn't done properly in your area isn't how that works. Clearly it is more than possible to have all manner of individuals use nasal narcan properly, it is a system problem if that isn't happening, not an intervention issue.
 
Tigger said:
If we based the success of interventions by only looking at small areas...oh wait we wouldn't do that.

Saying that you don't support something because it isn't done properly in your area isn't how that works. Clearly it is more than possible to have all manner of individuals use nasal narcan properly, it is a system problem if that isn't happening, not an intervention issue.
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I'm not saying that a widespread generalization needs to be made about the practicality of using Narcan based on a small location. But I am saying that if it doesn't work in his area, then there is no need to force it there either. That's the beauty of adapting to local needs and situations. We don't have national protocols, now do we? Certainly everyone can be trained to the same level everywhere...
 
MonkeyArrow said:
I'm not saying that a widespread generalization needs to be made about the practicality of using Narcan based on a small location. But I am saying that if it doesn't work in his area, then there is no need to force it there either. That's the beauty of adapting to local needs and situations. We don't have national protocols, now do we? Certainly everyone can be trained to the same level everywhere...
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If you have an opiate issue in your locale, why would you not wish to adapt this? Sure it might take some work, but that's not exactly a reason to just give up.
 
Tigger said:
If you have an opiate issue in your locale, why would you not wish to adapt this? Sure it might take some work, but that's not exactly a reason to just give up.
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Well, not-really-OPs locale (presumably) has an opiate problem, tried Narcan, and saw that it didn't work too well. I am simply responding to your statement that poor training does not negate practicality, because if you don't actually properly administer the medication (spraying it over the patient's face), then it has no use, therefore, its functionality is negated. Nowhere did I say that they should abandon Narcan or that it can't work, but it currently doesn't work, and that should be recognized.
 
MonkeyArrow said:
Well, not-really-OPs locale (presumably) has an opiate problem, tried Narcan, and saw that it didn't work too well. I am simply responding to your statement that poor training does not negate practicality, because if you don't actually properly administer the medication (spraying it over the patient's face), then it has no use, therefore, its functionality is negated. Nowhere did I say that they should abandon Narcan or that it can't work, but it currently doesn't work, and that should be recognized.
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I have no idea what sort of point you are trying to make here so I'm going to just go ahead and give up now.
 
Tigger said:
Most of our cops out here have it. Have to yet to see or hear of any issues. The subpar training in your area does not negate its practicality.
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I dont disagree, but i think this is why i feel narcan should be reserved for EMS trained personnel. We have Cops who are EMTs, they should be allowed to carry it and deploy it, but not every officer who takes a 2 hour class. I have no problem with narcan proliferation. We make the cops recert the CPR card every 2 years, but a one nd done class on narcan is not sufficient to maintain the skill, even if its an online training video
 
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