First Ride Along

[reaper]

*While I respect your degrees and certifications, who are you to tell me what I can and cannot discuss? I am in no way misrepresenting myself and everyone on these forums has the option to agree or disagree with me. What I don't appreciate is being dismissed.

*Who are you to say I am not? When you make things personal like that you cause problems. I meet all the requirements to ride along and assist and EMT-B/P on a call.

*I have also observed a doctor and I have never been denied permission by a patient to observe. Similarly, I have also been asked by patients on the ambulance if I am a student, and have never heard any objections to my being there.

My apologies for wishing to further educate myself though. Now that I know you disapprove, I will stop observing.

Few things. Expect the rants. You can add your opinion to any thread. But, you should not be giving advice, when you are not even in school yet. If your area service allows ride alongs, that is fine. But, you cannot legally "assist" with pt care. You are not certified to work and you are not affiliated with any school. Thus your service is breaking the law, if they allow you to assist with Pt care.

Why not go to school first and try and learn what you should know. Then ride clinicals, where you can put what you have learned to practice.

I have not had any problems with your postings. Until you offered advice to someone. Wait till you have that experience in the field, to offer up what should or should not be done.

 

[trevor1189]

Someone pop some popcorn, grab a beer, and sit back; this is gonna be interesting... B) Be gentle R/r, he is young and knows not what he says...

Please don't, and I do... I am sick of this bull on this site. Just because someone has more education, does not dismiss the opinion of those with a lesser education.

I would ask that if you have something to say to me that violates the site's rules or has the potential of getting this thread closed, please private message me. I don't like it when topics get closed because things get "heated."

 

[trevor1189]

Few things. Expect the rants. You can add your opinion to any thread. But, you should not be giving advice, when you are not even in school yet. If your area service allows ride alongs, that is fine. But, you cannot legally "assist" with pt care. You are not certified to work and you are not affiliated with any school. Thus your service is breaking the law, if they allow you to assist with Pt care.

Why not go to school first and try and learn what you should know. Then ride clinicals, where you can put what you have learned to practice.

I have not had any problems with your postings. Until you offered advice to someone. Wait till you have that experience in the field, to offer up what should or should not be done.

Legally, in my depts. I am classified as an ambulance attendant. Those things that I assist with outside my scope of practice are under the direct or standing orders and supervision of an EMT or Paramedic willing to absorb liability for the consequences because they know that I am doing what I know how to do and not compromising patient care.

I am planning on going to school but, I don't get to make the schedules. Therefore, I am trying to get a jump on my education before classes start.

Also, in this thread I have advised my opinion based on being a ride along or "ambulance attendant."

 

[ffemt8978]

Please don't, and I do... I am sick of this bull on this site. Just because someone has more education, does not dismiss the opinion of those with a lesser education.

I would ask that if you have something to say to me that violates the site's rules or has the potential of getting this thread closed, please private message me. I don't like it when topics get closed because things get "heated."

Then make your arguments using logic and facts, and not emotions. In case you haven't noticed around here, threads get heated and then closed because people don't do this.

Since you singled out Rid earlier, let me use his posting style as an example (apologies, Rid). While his posts certainly make people upset, have you actually set aside your emotions and read what he posts? He makes very persuasive arguments without resorting to emotion, name calling, insults, or anything else that violates our forum rules. The problem is that some people read what he says, take exception to it because they feel he is attacking them personally when in fact he is challenging their perceptions, beliefs, and ideology...which is the whole purpose of a discussion.

 

[trevor1189]

The problem is that some people read what he says, take exception to it because they feel he is attacking them personally when in fact he is challenging their perceptions, beliefs, and ideology...which is the whole purpose of a discussion.

I have no problem with people challenging my perceptions, beliefs, or ideologies, but see below. Rid sort of did single me out on that one.

Not to be rude, but what authority do you have to make an opinion? Really, you have not even started an EMT class but will discuss on what should be or not be allowed?

 

[reaper]

Maybe he was talking to the others that had not started school yet?

 

[Sasha]

I have no problem with people challenging my perceptions, beliefs, or ideologies, but see below. Rid sort of did single me out on that one.

Maybe because you're the only one who hasn't even started school who is not only saying what school teaches and doesn't teach and that you are learning something valuable from ride times before you're a student. You don't even have the education to know if they're teaching you bad habits or how it's supposed to be done. It's like showing a patient an X-Ray, you can tell them whatever you want about it and they wont know if you're a complete idiot or know what they're talking about because they have zero education about it.

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

Maybe he was talking to the others that had not started school yet?

Maybe because you're the only one who hasn't even started school who is not only saying what school teaches and doesn't teach and that you are learning something valuable from ride times before you're a student. You don't even have the education to know if they're teaching you bad habits or how it's supposed to be done. It's like showing a patient an X-Ray, you can tell them whatever you want about it and they wont know if you're a complete idiot or know what they're talking about because they have zero education about it.

It is true that I have noticed quite a few pre-EMSers (or those in MFR or EMT school) here and it is odd how they all seem to have an expert opinion on EMS when they have next to no real life experience. I think Rid was mearly pointing out that uneducated input from someone with no or little education/experiecne/certification to back it up means little to those that have worked in this field forever. "What right do they then have to dictate of they feel EMS should be?" is my translation of Rids comments. Lets be honest, for someone that only has First Aid Certification, some people sure have a lot of opinions on how the emergency medical profession. Maybe one day after you have a few years under teh belt, you will lok back on those posts and hear the "rants" of the pre-newbies and think, "I was such a _____."

 

[ffemt8978]

Okay, we've hijacked this thread long enough. Let's get back on topic, please.

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

Okay, we've hijacked this thread long enough. Let's get back on topic, please.

OK...

just wondering how i go about signing up for one? like what is the process?
Contact your local Ambulance company and see if they allow it and then as them how to sign up, if you are able.

and do you guys like when people do ride alongs?
Not really, but I am nowhere near as against it as Rid. ^_^

 

[Jeremy89]

Well, one of my pet peeves is students or third riders who are in it for the lights and sirens and not patient care........The ones that dont care/dont want to learn on their own, AS WELL AS ON CLINICALS, and who are just there to be in the middle of the drama !!!!

OMG...


I work with techs in the ER who are that way. Won't help anybody or do anything, but the second "Trauma team A" goes overhead, they go running....

irritates the CRAP outta me....

 

[Ms.Medic]

*While I respect your degrees and certifications, who are you to tell me what I can and cannot discuss? I am in no way misrepresenting myself and everyone on these forums has the option to agree or disagree with me. What I don't appreciate is being dismissed.

*Who are you to say I am not? When you make things personal like that you cause problems. I meet all the requirements to ride along and assist and EMT-B/P on a call.

*I have also observed a doctor and I have never been denied permission by a patient to observe. Similarly, I have also been asked by patients on the ambulance if I am a student, and have never heard any objections to my being there.

My apologies for wishing to further educate myself though. Now that I know you disapprove, I will stop observing.

Wishing to further educate yourself, or trying to get a step ahead of your future classmates ???


Just get in class first !!!.....it couldnt get any simpler than that. Medics are usually not going to be rude about you riding out while in front of you, but to very many, it is more of a hassel, more of an annoyance than anything else, and yes of course we say otherwise to you. We have enough to watch out for while having "real students" 4 days a week, but then third riders who are doing it "just to try and get a step ahead of others who will be in your class", we do like to let loose and be "cut ups" at the station, without having to be sooooooo "professional" behind the scenes too.

Doing things that should be common sense like "tearing tape" for an iv getting started, or "throwing trash away", or "moving something out of the way", is not something that you really even need to learn in class, hopefully. It should just be common sense, that anyone would do.

Geez, just get into class, then ride. And discuss.

 

[Ms.Medic]

OMG...


I work with techs in the ER who are that way. Won't help anybody or do anything, but the second "Trauma team A" goes overhead, they go running....

irritates the CRAP outta me....

Most definetly irritating.......for sure.

The same ones that want to volunteer, "because they love helping people", but when its just a "sick call", no one shows. Yep.

 

[Sasha]

Most definetly irritating.......for sure.

The same ones that want to volunteer, "because they love helping people", but when its just a "sick call", no one shows. Yep.

Psht. I get out of bed for nothing short of full arrest

 

[MSDeltaFlt]

Which is why I placed that sentence "and dont WANT to get involved" in my paragraph.
We've had "just riders", not students, come in and ride and just stand in the way trying to see "the nasties" on a critical call, but not really care whats going on around them or with the patient. Why they even came to ride is beyond me. They'll even tell you they dont care about learning or understanding, they just want to see if they can handle seeing that type of stuff.
And, Ive had students come in to ride and while intubating a patient, I say "here, place this on the tube" and literally throw it off to the side because he didnt know what I meant for him to do with it instead of asking me, and after being appalled and telling him not to do that again, the very next run, I asked him to place the c-collar on the patient while the other one held c-spine, HE DID THE CRAP AGAIN !!!!!!! Threw the fn c-collar to the side of the patient while I was cutting clothes off to look for anything else life threatening. If Im in the middle of a critical call, and talking to/working with my partner, focusing on my patient, looking and thinking to myself whats best for the patient, Im not slowing my roll to explain something for a student, it can wait until afterwards. I have to be a patient advocate too. They need to keep up. When they come on in the morning to ride, they should be checking the unit with you, and if they come across something they dont know how to use or what it is, they should ask and be familiar with it. We're not here to babysit them, or hand them all the information for them to pass their class with.....It takes Initiative, even as a student. In my opinion. I had to do it as a student and I managed quite well waiting until afterwards to discuss something bad, and learning on my own by playing with the "toys" in the unit and asking questions then. What the h%LL ??? All I can say is GEEZ, just start praying !!!

Bless your heart for being stuck in that type of situation. Bad situations can result in further bad situations. I can see both your possibilities and mine in this very same scenario.

Not to be rude, but what authority do you have to make an opinion? Really, you have not even started an EMT class but will discuss on what should be or not be allowed? This would be alike me discussing what medical school students should be exposed to while in medical school or in residency.

Sorry, I totally disagree with ride alongs. I don't need voyeurs I need medical professionals to assure treatment. I don't want someone that wants to see some action. Sorry, this is not the 70's and almost everyone that even has an interest can determine what the goal or function of EMS is. Ride along in schools are clinicals. They should meet and be trained/educated enough to assist or at least know enough to get out of my way.

How would you feel knowing the bank teller or grocery clerk that thought about a change of life might be in the back of the EMS unit as your loved one will be viewed and everything discussed will be seen and heard by that person that has no ties or real reason to be there except to gawk.

I don't need any additonal person to "tear my tape" drain my IV line, nor see my females chest while I do a XII lead. I have enough responsibility to assure safety to my patient, partner and others at the scene. While making a differential diagnosis and administer treatment. I don't mind students as there is a purpose and those have well written goals, objectives and are responsible to someone. Not to also mention the liability, and the possible risks these "observers" are exposed to.

Do those that allow riders, ask each patient and person prior to any potential viewing, or before asking pertinent questions as described per HIPAA? Just one slip of the tongue or referrence could be detrimental to an EMS.

Want to be an EMT take the course... it's simple enough.

Would you mind a non-medical person to be in observing your physician while he examines and checks your prostate or perform a pelvic? The same issues...

R/r 911

And, yes, ride alongs should be students already and not just "I think I want to be an EMT" without wanting to jump in and do some work. This isn't fun and games and "Ooh, look how cool that is".

To be totally honest with the OP, doing all of the little things for the paramedic really doesn't amount up to much. Doing a detailed pt assessment and aquiring the knowledge of what's going on with a pt and being a pt advocate is what it's all about. That's the cool part; doing the right thing. Being a paramedic's assistant, on the other hand, means precisely d%*k.

My humble 0.02.

 

[daedalus]

Legally, in my depts. I am classified as an ambulance attendant. Those things that I assist with outside my scope of practice are under the direct or standing orders and supervision of an EMT or Paramedic willing to absorb liability for the consequences because they know that I am doing what I know how to do and not compromising patient care.

I am planning on going to school but, I don't get to make the schedules. Therefore, I am trying to get a jump on my education before classes start.

Also, in this thread I have advised my opinion based on being a ride along or "ambulance attendant."

You are classified as an ambulance attendant with certification!??? Your department has broken the law.

 

[Ms.Medic]

Psht. I get out of bed for nothing short of full arrest

And mine would be the flight calls,,,lol

 

[trevor1189]

Maybe he was talking to the others that had not started school yet?

I don't think so, as I was the only one speaking from a ride alongs prospective, not to mention he quoted me and said you.

OMG...


I work with techs in the ER who are that way. Won't help anybody or do anything, but the second "Trauma team A" goes overhead, they go running....

irritates the CRAP outta me....

That would annoy me too. However, I live a few blocks from one of the EMS stations I'm a member of, and I try to make every call I can, regardless of the the call nature.

Wishing to further educate yourself, or trying to get a step ahead of your future classmates ???


Just get in class first !!!.....it couldnt get any simpler than that. Medics are usually not going to be rude about you riding out while in front of you, but to very many, it is more of a hassel, more of an annoyance than anything else, and yes of course we say otherwise to you. We have enough to watch out for while having "real students" 4 days a week, but then third riders who are doing it "just to try and get a step ahead of others who will be in your class", we do like to let loose and be "cut ups" at the station, without having to be sooooooo "professional" behind the scenes too.

Doing things that should be common sense like "tearing tape" for an iv getting started, or "throwing trash away", or "moving something out of the way", is not something that you really even need to learn in class, hopefully. It should just be common sense, that anyone would do.

Geez, just get into class, then ride. And discuss.

Even if I was trying to get ahead of my classmates and trying to get "ahead of the game", what is the problem with that?

I just mentioned the tape thing as an example and everyone seems to jump on it. I didn't say that is all I do. I was just using that as an example. Like I said earlier, anticipating what the medic is going to do is really important. If you can assist the medic on board, and save them time they have more time to explain what they are doing you. That is ultimately a good thing.

You are classified as an ambulance attendant with certification!??? Your department has broken the law.

At my one station, we have 3 positions on the sheet for ambulance calls.

Tech, Driver, and Attendant. I am the attendant when I ride along.The driver has the same certifications as me. The other station has the driver required to be an EMT.

As for the attendant position, there is nothing illegal about it. Check the Pennsylvania Scope of Practice for Prehospital Practitioners. Ambulance Attendant is listed on there as to what they can do.

I appologize for getting this thread off topic, but considering I am a ride along and that is what this thread is about, I think I am qualified to express my opinion on EMS in this thread.

 

[Ridryder911]

I don't think so, as I was the only one speaking from a ride alongs prospective, not to mention he quoted me and said you.

That would annoy me too. However, I live a few blocks from one of the EMS stations I'm a member of, and I try to make every call I can, regardless of the the call nature.

Even if I was trying to get ahead of my classmates and trying to get "ahead of the game", what is the problem with that?

I just mentioned the tape thing as an example and everyone seems to jump on it. I didn't say that is all I do. I was just using that as an example. Like I said earlier, anticipating what the medic is going to do is really important. If you can assist the medic on board, and save them time they have more time to explain what they are doing you. That is ultimately a good thing.

At my one station, we have 3 positions on the sheet for ambulance calls.

Tech, Driver, and Attendant. I am the attendant when I ride along.The driver has the same certifications as me. The other station has the driver required to be an EMT.

As for the attendant position, there is nothing illegal about it. Check the Pennsylvania Scope of Practice for Prehospital Practitioners. Ambulance Attendant is listed on there as to what they can do.

I appologize for getting this thread off topic, but considering I am a ride along and that is what this thread is about, I think I am qualified to express my opinion on EMS in this thread.

Again, I'll ask you as I would anyone that gives an opinion without any training in EMS? "What are your qualifications" except that you want to get "ahead of the game" (game?). You observed some EMS calls and even you admit you have no education, no formal training or speciality...other than to want to watch others. That is voyeurism or in other words gawking. Since you cannot assess, treat, then really what are you doing?

To the original subject; why would anyone think that EMS would be any different than any other medical area? Do you also get to observe surgeries? Just because; Oh maybe one day you would like to be a surgeon. Or how about a pelvic since you may want to be a Gynecologist? .. Same thing.

This is not a side show! Our patients deserve dignity and should expect when they call for medical help, they actually get medical help, not to see if they can aid in deciding in a career change. When someone intervenes or even touches a patient representing EMS they should be able to deliver medical care either as a professional (paid or volunteer) or in a student capability under the guidance and pre-existing contract as doing so.

In offering an opinion, I guess anyone can offer a view. Opinions should be based upon experience gained from formal education, training, experience to make those views valid. Other wise views have that have no validity other just what they are.... views or ideas.

Patient care is very confidential thing. Developing trust is essential and as well demonstrates our profession as having integrity. Again there is no valid reason of having to have a "ride along" to see of one is interested in a profession. Do your research discussing, learning and upon the clinical phase within the EMT portion; one should be able to decide. One has not wasted much money or time obtaining the EMT level and did not waste effort on the minimal material covered that it cannot be used on a personal level.

Just because your state is a two or three decades behind, does not make it right.