"Mercedes" Ambulances Sending the Wrong Message?

CANMAN

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This is what you call and ugly ambulance: I have worked in a actual Sprinter and was not a fan at all. Although it road nice with bumpy roads, I felt the back and forth swaying of the unit due to the height offset the nice ride. Standing room is nice, but the bench and airway seat area's have next to no room at all. I also agree the front is uncomfortable as well. I will take an F450 or 550 truck front with a box anyday.
 

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Tigger

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Incidentally most ford E-350 Type 2 conversions have a height of around 100" and the Sprinters are at 103," and they are not nearly as top heavy as a result of a not having the fiberglass topper.
 

DPM

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Incidentally most ford E-350 Type 2 conversions have a height of around 100" and the Sprinters are at 103," and they are not nearly as top heavy as a result of a not having the fiberglass topper.

I believe you here, but it certainly "felt" different. They felt very top heavy to me when I used to drive them.

There was enough room in the back to stand (I'm 5'8") but I felt that the bench was super close to the gurney. Also, the way that the latches on the bench stuck out meant they were often broken off by people's legs and shins. I also felt that there wasn't a lot of cabinet space or equipment storage. That being said, I think that's an issue with all type II's and not just the sprinter.
 

Honeybadger

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Amr in seattle has a fleet of type 2 sprinters and our old fleet of ford's is mostly type 2 with type 3 for bariatric and cct duties. We have gas powered boxes and diesels, and one lone chevy duramax type 3.

I hate the sprinters in a lot of ways. Gutless engines with awful turbo lag (we opted for the top of the spec v6 diesel) and 5 speed auto slush boxes that can never decide on a gear. They're grumbly and slow, and just don't feel appropriate as an ambulance. Up in the mountains, when we gun it, the 7.3 fords just walk away like it was nothing from 55-70. On a straight, the healthier of our 250-500k mile fords are neck and neck. The only benefit the sprinter has is a silent idle, making for more relaxing posting, but I prefer engine off anyways.

Ride quality is hands down better in a Ford e series (and hopefully the new transit) the sprinters have unbelievably bouncy rides, partly because they are made to haul a load, and with more weight in the back, the Ford irons out bumps better.

Turn circle in the sprinters is incredible. City driving through traffic, I do appreciate that. But paired with the asthmatic engine and slow transmission, it does drag the overall performance down.

Brakes are wooden and numb in the sprinters. The ford is mushy, but linear and predictable. Steering is bad in both, with a slight edge to the sprinter, though the driving position takes away from the slightly better feel

Space in the sprinters is impressive. I can stand up and i'm nearly 6'5 with boots on. And the bench seat backrest we went for has a 4 point harness belt that is very comfortable. I won't speak to interior layouts as they're all different, but I do not feel like Leader (our brand) did a very high quality job. Surfaces and fit and finish feel cheap and lacking.

The minivan side door is lovely too, but they have a flaw wherein if they don't close completely, when you set off, the auto locks engage, and the door jams HARD, becoming nearly impossible to open.

Auto locks suck. You can't unlock or lock the back doors if the engine is running with the key, meaning you have to shut down the engine at every scene or climb back into the cab and use the door locks from there. No problems like this with the ford, making it a much better vehicle for accident scenes.

Compared to old 06 fords, sprinter interior wins. So much more legroom and an actual glovebox. Newer fords are comparable.

Sprinters average 18 to 20mpg. Fords get 14ish. Considering 60% of our fuel is spent idling, it's irrelevant.

And the big elephant in the room. Reliability. The sprinters are nightmares, both in terms of regular breakdowns and cost of maintenance. The Mercedes brand urea injection fluid alone costs us about $300 an oil change, they chew through headlight bulbs, and there is an inherent design flaw. The egr system stores the soot in a tank, which after a few minutes at 60mph, is dumped. Our engines often never break 45mph, often idling for 8 or 10 hours straight. This causes the system to foul, which heats up the sensor, overheats the wiring, and then melts the wiring harnesses. My old unit was out of service for three weeks of every month, for nearly five months. under 65k miles. Most of our sprinters are between 60 and 160k miles and are all regularly breaking down. Our fords are all 250 minimum, and rarely ever break

I moved out to the Eastside for more proper ems work (seattle fire never lets you do any patient care) and out here we get old fords with strobe bars instead of the fancy led bars of the mercs and a quarter million miles. Apart from our maintenence shop being nickel and dimed so hard they can't fix basic wear items like a screeching idler belt pully, our ford has never had a problem in a year now beyond a shift lever breaking once.

Overall, I like a twinkie for threading through traffic, but I'd prefer a 1 or 3 for the "proper ambulance" look. And it really bothers me for some reason that it doesn't say "AMBULANCE" anywhere on our rigs at amr.

The only type of rig I have not driven is a medium duty.
 

DesertMedic66

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And it really bothers me for some reason that it doesn't say "AMBULANCE" anywhere on our rigs at amr.

The only type of rig I have not driven is a medium duty.
Does it really need to say ambulance? I've never had anyone mistake my ambulance for anything else.

Some of ours say some of our BLS units say ambulance or nothing written. Our ALS either say Paramedic Unit or nothing written
 

Honeybadger

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Does it really need to say ambulance? I've never had anyone mistake my ambulance for anything else.

Some of ours say some of our BLS units say ambulance or nothing written. Our ALS either say Paramedic Unit or nothing written

It's weird and irrelevant but for some reason it bothers me
 

Clare

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The entire fleet is Mercedes. This is the latest variant. It's a custom module on a Sprinter chassis. Great piece of kit to work in.

9030984.jpg
 

Honeybadger

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That looks awesome, Clare. I feel like a minimod like that would make the sprinter feel much more like an ambulance, while keeping the body dimensions nice and tight. One thing I don't like, aesthetically, is the tiny steel wheels that most sprinters have. Our rigs are all 2500's and opted for the very nice looking 17 inch alloy rims which look very nice and give us a bit of extra ground clearance and a slightly improved ride on Seattle's paved-over goat paths laid down by the Roman Legion. That said, I'd guess that your mini mods are all duallies in the rear, and I think that the ugly steelies are the only option for spare-wheel fitment purposes. I like the high visibility look of the UK rigs.

Our mainstay of the fleet is the good old trauma twinkie with the engine from a big manly tractor

maxresdefault.jpg


And our sprinters
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And then we have this Monstrosity. Our retarded manager wanted to make the lights all green and blue. Thank god blue is illegal in WA state. As it is, people see it running code and think that there's just a very unusually aggressive parade going on.

BzC4_7iCAAARudL.jpg:large
 
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DPM

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I hate the sprinters in a lot of ways. Gutless engines with awful turbo lag (we opted for the top of the spec v6 diesel) and 5 speed auto slush boxes that can never decide on a gear. They're grumbly and slow, and just don't feel appropriate as an ambulance....

...But paired with the asthmatic engine and slow transmission...

...Space in the sprinters is impressive. I can stand up and i'm nearly 6'5 with boots on. And the bench seat backrest we went for has a 4 point harness belt that is very comfortable. I won't speak to interior layouts as they're all different, but I do not feel like Leader (our brand) did a very high quality job. Surfaces and fit and finish feel cheap and lacking.

All of these things too. Nice and tall in the back, but it's a narrow vehicle with no external compartments, and no amount of clever design is going to get you any more space back there.

And I'd forgotten about the speed!! Slooooow. Asthmatic is an excellent description.

Plus, this don't even really look like ambulances. My GF saw one from my old service and said it looked like an ice cream truck.

DPM
 

TransportJockey

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Why do you need external compartments? And they do make box sprinters. Ran in one in NM and loved the type III sprinters. Plus those have external companrtments.
 

Tigger

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Why do you need external compartments? And they do make box sprinters. Ran in one in NM and loved the type III sprinters. Plus those have external companrtments.
I'm not sure we could fit our extraneous equipment into something without exterior compartments. Wilderness backpack, two ATV helmets, two sets of Level C PPE, vac mattress, inflatable car seat, some basic tools, tire chains, and a spare tire. Takes up some space, for sure. Though in the city a lot of that would not be necessary.
 

DPM

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External compartments mean that fire re-stock, back boards etc aren't taking up the already space inside.

I have no experience with the MOD sprinter, but I can only imagine that the extra weight makes the engine issues worse.
 

Clare

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We have two exterior doors - one is for access and the other is for the equipment cache where the response kit, LP15, portable oxygen, combi carrier, Mark 11 and stair chair are stored. On the drivers side there is an external door for access to the compartment where the bulk oxygen is stored.
 

Honeybadger

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Why do you need external compartments? And they do make box sprinters. Ran in one in NM and loved the type III sprinters. Plus those have external companrtments.

External compartments for things like your stair chair, backboards, clamshells, and main o2 tanks makes for a much easier to organize, spacious, and tidy interior. I'm curious to see how the new ford transits with the 3.2 five cylinder diesel do. But we may go for the ecoboost twin turbo v6 as well, which would absolutely perk up the speed problem these euro vans have.
 

Crash Course

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...Auto locks suck. You can't unlock or lock the back doors if the engine is running with the key, meaning you have to shut down the engine at every scene or climb back into the cab and use the door locks from there. No problems like this with the ford, making it a much better vehicle for accident scenes.

Compared to old 06 fords, sprinter interior wins. So much more legroom and an actual glovebox. Newer fords are comparable.
...

Lots of valid points, although I will say that out new FORDs DO have auto lock as well. It is a pain because we are getting locked out, and then have to walk around to the driver's side to regain access. I took one to the Ford dealership and they said they could disable it next time it went in the shop, but also said it was a safety feature. I explained why it was not a good feature for emergecy services and they agreed.

Now my boss on the other hand can't seem to care enough though to have the work followed through with. I guess it doesn't seem like a very big deal from the POV of an office chair.

Anyways, all that is to say that I'm sure that the dealership could address the auto locks in the merc too. I can't see these getting very popular in areas that dont have good access to merc dealerships for maintenace - those who hate them should always have somewhere to go. :p

I did sit in a Ford transit generic model, the lack of leg roominess is actually very disapointing considering the size of the vehicle.
 

EBMEMT

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@Honeybadger: $300 per oil change for the ures injection fluid was a shocker. A post on truth about cars had a similar complaint but the comments shed some light. Apparently, Mercedes charges dealers $6 gallon and they mark it up to $32 plus labor. But you can get DEF from the pump at a truck stop for around $2.79 gallon. May need an adapter, such as a cut up addblue bottle. And volkswagon dealers will sell you a 2.5gallon bottle of afdblue for $13.50, if you want to carry extra onboard in case you run dry.
 

Jim37F

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The other day at work we were talking about our new ambulance coming in, and one of the captains at station was apparently on the apparatus selection committee. He said the department looked at Sprinters (small, maneuverable, fuel efficient, etc.) But found when spec'ing the van out, apparently after putting all the equipment and gear we carry, the van load rating only allowed for an extra 750 lbs, and that's before adding patient and crew. I have no way to verify other than "that's what the captain said" though lol
 

Crash Course

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I think it is believable though. Didn't Ornge fail to notice a similar problem with their air ambulances? The medical interior plus all the equipment, supplies, and people must add up fast!
 
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