Doctors as patients

[wildrivermedic]

Just back from a run where the patient was our town doc. He's been our patient before, but this was my first time transporting him. An interesting experience... partner got him on the monitor and said "OK, see anything?":blink:

When we transferred care to the helicopter crew, my partner started to give the report, then stopped and asked the doc/patient to continue. She told me later this was to give him a small sense of control in a scary situation. It did seem to help him. And the report was excellent... though a little too inclusive. I believe he was still talking as they got off the ground.

Anyone else have experience with doctors as patients? It sounds like it could be awful. Lucky for us this guy is a friend and has lots of respect for our crew.

 

[Epi-do]

I used to run on a retired doc that was a diabetic, but never had to transport one that was still practicing.

 

[JPINFV]

I imagine that EMTs and paramedics (former or current) are worse. Oh, you want to put me on a non-rebreather just because? Yea... no. Oh, lay down on that backboard? Bite me, oh, and while we're at it, turn off the lights and sirens. I want to actually make it to the hospital.

 

[wildrivermedic]

Oh, lay down on that backboard? Bite me

Hilarious! This would be me.

 

[Aidey]

If I ever get into a car accident it is going to be a mess. I'm probably going to be accused of being combative, and thus I MUST have a head injury...

 

[bstone]

I had a retired neurologist as a patient one time. She was rather elderly and frail, but loved talking neurology. I am a future neurologist so I was particularly interested in what she had to say. She didn't get involved in her own care too much, but did ask a lot of good questions.

I like the part about showing the EKG to the town doc/patient. That's a good move.

 

[chillybreeze]

If I were to get in a wreck I would hope it would be outta my district. There are very few women on my squad and I know the first thing our guys are gonna wanna do is break out the trauma shears and start cutting off clothes!!:glare:

 

[Tigger]

I took a gastroenterologist and renowned infectious disease expert at one of the top hospitals in Boston. He had suffered some sort of brain aneurysm or bleed (the details escape me) and was now in a rehab hospital. My partner and I took him downtown to have some imaging done and it turned out to be one of the more interesting transports I've done. The doctor was still sharp as a tack but had lost a terrific deal of strength and the ability to cope with multiple thoughts (his words). Nonetheless he was able to explain in detail what had happened to him right down to how he knew he was having a bleed and had called 911 and convinced the responding BLS crew that he needed to be thrown in the back of the truck and hauled into one of the Level 1s. His wife was also incredibly knowledgeable and encouraged the doctor to share as much about his research and injury as he could stand without aggravating his symptoms. The call ended up taking close to five hours, but I could have cared less if it took the entire shift.

And as mentioned in other posts, I know I am a terrible patient to EMS. I got taken by an ILS crew after hitting a tree skiing, I refused the backboard, having my ski stuff getting cut off, and an IV since I knew it wasn't actually going to do much. Couldn't do much about the lights and sirens transport but the driver was still quite smooth.

 

[Veneficus]

Anyone else have experience with doctors as patients?

On a fairly regular basis actually. Never had a problem.

 

[Jambi]

Have been on a few and have always been a pleasant experience. I always remind myself that we owe such patients some professional courtesy.

A run one of my former partners went on was for a local ED doc having an MI. This doc always went out of his way to have a good working relationship with the local crews. Kinda of one of those, I need orders for such and such and I need you to trust me docs that a medic could count on over the radio. Well, doc had an MI, called 911, saw that it was my partner, said, "Oh Thank God it's you," and, " I'm having an MI and need MS!" Needless to say that run went off without a hitch and the Doc was back working in two weeks after his angio.

 

[NYMedic828]

I imagine that EMTs and paramedics (former or current) are worse. Oh, you want to put me on a non-rebreather just because? Yea... no. Oh, lay down on that backboard? Bite me, oh, and while we're at it, turn off the lights and sirens. I want to actually make it to the hospital.

This x 2.


I've had patients that were EMTs trying to tell me how to do my job for them or their family member.

 

[JPINFV]

I've had patients that were EMTs trying to tell me how to do my job for them or their family member.

Well, the patient does have a right to consent or refuse treatment options under the concept of autonomy.

 

[bahnrokt]

Worst so far was a vet whose 9y/o daughter fell on ice, hit her head and had a short loc. He knew enough about physiology to know certain things were bad signs. But wanted to rewrite all of the most basic of EMS protocols. "Nobody saw her go down? Then she goes on a board. Why? Because I said so. If you want to call the shots here is an RMA to sign and Ill go home."

Finally told him had had the option of sitting in back but in total silence or sitting up front and talking to the driver about whatever subject he'd like.

 

[CANDawg]

Well, the patient does have a right to consent or refuse treatment options under the concept of autonomy.

True, but the patient does not have the right to dictate treatment. If the EMT whose mother is on the stretcher is demanding morphine but you don't think it is appropriate or it contravenes your protocols, the patient isn't getting morphine.

 

[JPINFV]

Worst so far was a vet whose 9y/o daughter fell on ice, hit her head and had a short loc. He knew enough about physiology to know certain things were bad signs. But wanted to rewrite all of the most basic of EMS protocols. "Nobody saw her go down? Then she goes on a board. Why? Because I said so. If you want to call the shots here is an RMA to sign and Ill go home."

Finally told him had had the option of sitting in back but in total silence or sitting up front and talking to the driver about whatever subject he'd like.

[takes RMA]
[checks "refuses field treatment, but accepts transport," or what ever box is similar ]
[signs]
Ok, let's go to the hospital.

This is especially true when it comes to something silly like spinal immobilization.

 

[JPINFV]

True, but the patient does not have the right to dictate treatment. If the EMT whose mother is on the stretcher is demanding morphine but you don't think it is appropriate or it contravenes your protocols, the patient isn't getting morphine.

Depending on the situation, administering pain medications should be something that's given at least a second thought about administering. This is something where, at least in the states, a physician or physician relative is a bigger issue. Most areas allows physicians to take over care provided they sign the chart and ride with the patient.

 

[NYMedic828]

Well, the patient does have a right to consent or refuse treatment options under the concept of autonomy.

Yea well when a family member tells you that you are a racist and they are an EMT and this is not how you do things etc etc I'm going to report you blah blah...

Mind you all we did was tighten the stair chair straps because the patient was an uncooperative intox minor. Obviously makes me racist.

 

[medicdan]

Worst so far was a vet whose 9y/o daughter fell on ice, hit her head and had a short loc. He knew enough about physiology to know certain things were bad signs. But wanted to rewrite all of the most basic of EMS protocols. "Nobody saw her go down? Then she goes on a board. Why? Because I said so. If you want to call the shots here is an RMA to sign and Ill go home."

Finally told him had had the option of sitting in back but in total silence or sitting up front and talking to the driver about whatever subject he'd like.

Exactly as JP said... your patient is a minor, and there is a parent present, requesting specific treatment. If the parent doesn't want a board, and you have secured the proper signatures, they have the right to accept or reject any assessment, treatment or transport at any time.

 

[usalsfyre]

Worst so far was a vet whose 9y/o daughter fell on ice, hit her head and had a short loc. He knew enough about physiology to know certain things were bad signs. But wanted to rewrite all of the most basic of EMS protocols. "Nobody saw her go down? Then she goes on a board. Why? Because I said so. If you want to call the shots here is an RMA to sign and Ill go home."

Finally told him had had the option of sitting in back but in total silence or sitting up front and talking to the driver about whatever subject he'd like.

I can almost assure you if you offered me that choice you would be hearing from the the state/local EMS licensing agency regarding threatening abandonment. This is an entirely reasonable request, and "because I said so" is not an acceptable answer.

 

[usalsfyre]

True, but the patient does not have the right to dictate treatment. If the EMT whose mother is on the stretcher is demanding morphine but you don't think it is appropriate or it contravenes your protocols, the patient isn't getting morphine.

While I only have a certain amount of leeway to dictate what happens to me, I have EVERY right to refuse a given intervention assuming I am competent. If I only want a taxi ride that's my right at most systems.