As of dec 20 2012 all medic programs go to 2 years

[bajamedic]

THANKS TO THE FOOLS AT THE NATIONAL REGISTRY. I HOPE AS MANY STATES AS POSSIBLE OPT OUT OF THE NATIONAL REGISTRY. WE HAVE MEDICS WORKING ON BLS RIGS BECAUSE THEIR ARE NO JOBS. I CAN SEE THE FIRE SERVICE FIGHTING THIS AS IT MAKE NO SENSE. :angry: WHAT DEPARTMENTS CAN AFFORD TO SEND A GUY TO SCHOOL FOR 2 YEARS.

 

[Shishkabob]

2 year program, or accredited program?

Big difference.

It makes plenty of sense as it attempts to have a minimum standard in schools

 

[fast65]

So you don't think a better education requirement is a good thing? Care to go into more detail?

But as Linuss said, I'm pretty sure they need to be accredited, not two year programs.

Sent from my mobile command center

 

[SanDiegoEmt7]

So when the influx of 6 month trained paramedics slows down because "My god, two years of paramedic school is a lot of work just so can get that fire job." your amigos working BLS will have more jobs available to them.

 

[FrostbiteMedic]

I only have one thing to say: What is another semester of training going to hurt? Are you (the OP) against progressive educational standards for this profession? Personally, when I take my medic course (saving up for it so I can pay outta pocket) I hope that I have to be there two years. That will mean that I will receive more education. Education is the one thing that NO ONE can take away from you. The more I know, the more I have learned, the better I can treat and relate to my patients. So I hope that two years becomes the standard.

Just my $0.02

 

[8jimi8]

Should make it a 4 year standard with an option for 6.

then they should pay a living wage commensurate with your level of education.

 

[adamjh3]

WHAT DEPARTMENTS CAN AFFORD TO SEND A GUY TO SCHOOL FOR 2 YEARS.

There's a key just to the left of your A key, go ahead and hit that.

Why should an agency pay for schooling? In how many other fields does one get a free ride for their education?

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

 

[fast65]

Should make it a 4 year standard with an option for 6.

then they should pay a living wage commensurate with your level of education.

I'm in 100% agreement

Sent from my mobile command center

 

[FrostbiteMedic]

I CAN SEE THE FIRE SERVICE FIGHTING THIS AS IT MAKE NO SENSE. :angry: WHAT DEPARTMENTS CAN AFFORD TO SEND A GUY TO SCHOOL FOR 2 YEARS.

Oh, I almost forgot to add that I really hope that the fire service does NOT fight this. Why? Because, even though I am a firefighter, I believe that to get the recognition as a profession EMS should be totally seperate from the fire service. Again, just my $0.02.

 

[bajamedic]

Accredited OK.............

Well define accredited? Subjective or objective determination. Don't think you are talking to a new guy, I have been in public safety since 1985. It does not serve the job market. Medic skills are not that hard. It's just like being a pilot. Kids can come over here from India and train for 600 hours and go home and fly 737 for a living. American kids need 3 times that. We are in recession and agency and students don't have money. It is nothing more than the College mafia of educators funding there jobs. In Germany it is an apprentice program OJT. We have a shortage of money to put rigs on the road, that is why EMT-Ps are working as basics. MONEY is the issue, and we are headed in the wrong direction. NREMT is in OHIO and they are not on the streets of southern California and should have no influence on what happens here. Once again our trade is making it something it is not, there is a million ways to put water on a fire, and I can hire better firefighters out of Tijuana for less, you don't need a 2 year degree to be a medic. Law enforcement is 100 times harder than EMS and they train officers is 6 months. Bullets and crazy people are allot harder to deal with than sick or torn in half. LIKE I SAID BEFORE, I HOPE MOST STATES OPT OUT OF THE NREMT PROGRAM.

A living wage you will never get paid. Attorneys are waiting tables. Quit being brainwashed and do the research, recession. Allot of departments are going back to volunteers. Doctor mob and nurse mob will never let you get paid more than them. Go be a Doctor. This is street EMS.

 

[8jimi8]

Well define accredited? Subjective or objective determination. Don't think you are talking to a new guy, I have been in public safety since 1985. It does not serve the job market. Medic skills are not that hard. It's just like being a pilot. Kids can come over here from India and train for 600 hours and go home and fly 737 for a living. American kids need 3 times that. We are in recession and agency and students don't have money. It is nothing more than the College mafia of educators funding there jobs. In Germany it is an apprentice program OJT. We have a shortage of money to put rigs on the road, that is why EMT-Ps are working as basics. MONEY is the issue, and we are headed in the wrong direction. NREMT is in OHIO and they are not on the streets of southern California and should have no influence on what happens here. Once again our trade is making it something it is not, there is a million ways to put water on a fire, and I can hire better firefighters out of Tijuana for less, you don't need a 2 year degree to be a medic. Law enforcement is 100 times harder than EMS and they train officers is 6 months. Bullets and crazy people are allot harder to deal with than sick or torn in half. LIKE I SAID BEFORE, I HOPE MOST STATES OPT OUT OF THE NREMT PROGRAM.

A living wage you will never get paid. Attorneys are waiting tables. Quit being brainwashed and do the research, recession. Allot of departments are going back to volunteers. Doctor mob and nurse mob will never let you get paid more than them. Go be a Doctor. This is street EMS.

ok you lost me there Rambo

 

[Chimpie]

Well define accredited? Subjective or objective determination. Don't think you are talking to a new guy, I have been in public safety since 1985. It does not serve the job market. Medic skills are not that hard. It's just like being a pilot. Kids can come over here from India and train for 600 hours and go home and fly 737 for a living. American kids need 3 times that. We are in recession and agency and students don't have money. It is nothing more than the College mafia of educators funding there jobs. In Germany it is an apprentice program OJT. We have a shortage of money to put rigs on the road, that is why EMT-Ps are working as basics. MONEY is the issue, and we are headed in the wrong direction. NREMT is in OHIO and they are not on the streets of southern California and should have no influence on what happens here. Once again our trade is making it something it is not, there is a million ways to put water on a fire, and I can hire better firefighters out of Tijuana for less, you don't need a 2 year degree to be a medic. Law enforcement is 100 times harder than EMS and they train officers is 6 months. Bullets and crazy people are allot harder to deal with than sick or torn in half. LIKE I SAID BEFORE, I HOPE MOST STATES OPT OUT OF THE NREMT PROGRAM.

A living wage you will never get paid. Attorneys are waiting tables. Quit being brainwashed and do the research, recession. Allot of departments are going back to volunteers. Doctor mob and nurse mob will never let you get paid more than them. Go be a Doctor. This is street EMS.

Wow, so much of this needs to be pulled apart and debated but I need to head to an appointment. Who wants to do this for me?

 

[fast65]

I still fail to see your point, it seems as though you prefer that EMS regresses back to the days where we just toss them in the back of a truck and drive to the hospital with no initial treatment.

Oregon requires a two year degree to be a paramedic, and I personally think it's a great idea. We shouldn't be encouraging cookbook medics, just so FD's can say they have "paramedics".

Sent from my mobile command center

 

[medicsb]

Boo-hoo.

 

[MrBrown]

Wrong. All programs need to be "accredited"

There is a patch factory in Northern Indiana that is "accredited" and the Fire Service sits on the board of the COAEMSP so what is the point? Talk about the fox investigating the hen house.

Until the US sees a problem with somebody who has as little as 16 weeks of total "education" being allowed to practice at a level that in other nations takes four to seven years to obtain there will be no advancement.

 

[Akulahawk]

I still fail to see your point, it seems as though you prefer that EMS regresses back to the days where we just toss them in the back of a truck and drive to the hospital with no initial treatment.

Oregon requires a two year degree to be a paramedic, and I personally think it's a great idea. We shouldn't be encouraging cookbook medics, just so FD's can say they have "paramedics".

Sent from my mobile command center

I also think that Oregon has the right idea. Require a 2 year degree, with an option for 4 or 6... depending upon the ultimate goal of the Paramedic. Hmmm. Sounds a LOT like what the Nurses did. Would I like to see a more thorough education for Paramedics? Absolutely! Where do I think it should go? I think the education should be more like a PA's, just optimized for prehospital. Should a Paramedic wish to become a PA, all that would be needed is the additional coursework to complete a PA's education, much like UC Davis's FNP program. If the FNP wants to also be a PA, the additional coursework just needs to be done...

 

[Aidey]

I'm totally failing to see what on earth you are so worked up about OP. The current low education standards are atrocious and desperately need to be increased. Screw the recession, "Nurse mob", "Doctor mob", and the IAFF/IAFC.

 

[WolfmanHarris]

Two years for PCP (BLS) in Ontario. A further year for ACP (ALS). The world did not end. In fact the change was one of the main reasons I now make $34.50/hr (PCP) and that is not even the top in the Province. In contrast minimum wage here is $10.75/hr.

 

[AlphaButch]

Well define accredited? Subjective or objective determination. Don't think you are talking to a new guy, I have been in public safety since 1985. It does not serve the job market. Medic skills are not that hard. It's just like being a pilot. Kids can come over here from India and train for 600 hours and go home and fly 737 for a living. American kids need 3 times that. We are in recession and agency and students don't have money. It is nothing more than the College mafia of educators funding there jobs. In Germany it is an apprentice program OJT. We have a shortage of money to put rigs on the road, that is why EMT-Ps are working as basics. MONEY is the issue, and we are headed in the wrong direction. NREMT is in OHIO and they are not on the streets of southern California and should have no influence on what happens here. Once again our trade is making it something it is not, there is a million ways to put water on a fire, and I can hire better firefighters out of Tijuana for less, you don't need a 2 year degree to be a medic. Law enforcement is 100 times harder than EMS and they train officers is 6 months. Bullets and crazy people are allot harder to deal with than sick or torn in half. LIKE I SAID BEFORE, I HOPE MOST STATES OPT OUT OF THE NREMT PROGRAM.

A living wage you will never get paid. Attorneys are waiting tables. Quit being brainwashed and do the research, recession. Allot of departments are going back to volunteers. Doctor mob and nurse mob will never let you get paid more than them. Go be a Doctor. This is street EMS.

Accreditation by CAAHEP is an objective set of requirements that is not that hard to obtain. The new rules do NOT require a 2 year education, they require that you have attended an accredited program.

As far as it serving the job market - It is not the goal of any EMS service I know of (Private, public, or third) to serve the job market. These services do not exist to give people jobs. They exist to provide a service, make a profit, or both.

"Medic skills are not that hard." - This would depend on your service. I don't find the National Registery paramedic curriculum difficult, but I found the curriculum for my particular service to be very challenging. You won't have to worry about EMT-Ps working as Basics. Raising the education standards will lessen the supply of certified paramedics. You may however have to worry about a heavy abundance of basics.

When comparing education/pay ratios, it quickly becomes a "chicken or egg" discussion. Which comes first? higher pay? or higher education?

Money is an issue. The only way to improve on this is to provide more value and demand higher reimbursement. How do agencies provide more value? Expand services, raise standards, raise efficiency, etc. The easiest way is to raise standards and increase the barrier to entry of services - thereby reducing supply.

How do individuals provide more value? A higher education is a pretty easy way to do it.

Doctors and Nurses against the pay rates? Irrelevant (with a few exceptions) and not in my observation. They don't decide what you get paid (unless you're hospital based). I've discussed education and pay with many doctors and nurses, the common complaint isn't regarding our pay. The major gripe is that EMS tends to have little in the way of education.

I can only think of one Law Enforcement agency in my area that does not require a two year education before going to the academy, unless done with a prior military waiver.

At my service, folks get paid a wage based on the value they bring to the service. Which is very livable. Again, EMS agencies don't exist to give people a job.

I agree that we're in a recession, which makes it an ideal time to raise the standards. Those who are committed to the job and want to excel will meet those standards. Those who aren't, will have to go elsewhere. Raising the standards will reduce the pool of applicants - and as the economy recovers, compensation can rise (and it will have to, due to the decrease in qualified personnel).

 

[medichopeful]

Edit: Probably should have read the "troll" sticky before responding.