Motojunkie
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Orlando Fire Department will be transporting patients starting today (or tomorrow)! God help us all . . .
Big day for EMS in Orlando!
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TransportJockey
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Sounds like an unfortunate day for Orlando FL
reaper
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So much for quality care!
OP
OP
Motojunkie
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You have no idea
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I have a question. If the quality of care is so bad why would the city grant the contract? I understand how people say this about non-transporting departments. However, I would assume, and it may just be my lack of experience in the field, that a contract wouldn't be granted if the level of care is going to be substandard? Not trying to start a fight, just trying to understand the thought process.
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reaper
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Bingo! We have a winner!
Not being from Orlando (love the city though), I wouldn't know- but this seems to be the right answer. Who says both aren't good?
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Motojunkie
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I normally agree with you and do withhold judgement, but I work for Rural/Metro here and have seen on a number of occasions things that should have been taken care of that were not. There are good medics, of course, but the majority are not. And, naturally, there are good and bad medics at RMA too.
Lady_EMT
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Agreed. I'm not sure if the dislike is coming from the EMS vs Fire standpoint, or if there is actual reasoning behind it.
Also, they may not be awesome, but they probably also don't have the experience yet to be able to develop as a squad. I'm sure after they get some practice, they'll be just as good as the local EMS department. They just need the chance.
TransportJockey
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Until 100% of the fire medics that are forced to do ALS say they WANT to be paramedics and they didn't just get the cert to get hired on as a hosemonkey, I'll keep thinking that fire stepping into another government services area is a bad idea.
Stories like this make me happy that our town doesn't have a paid fire service (ther'es no point in paying them when they only run 200 or so calls a year, EMS runs 6x that number easily and we are paid. ) and that none of htem are EMTs.
Stories like this make me happy that our town doesn't have a paid fire service (ther'es no point in paying them when they only run 200 or so calls a year, EMS runs 6x that number easily and we are paid. ) and that none of htem are EMTs.
akflightmedic
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Agreed!
Search any fire forum and listen to all the wannabes wondering why they don't have a job or how can they better their chance of being hired and the same answer over and over is not get a degree in fire science, it is not take leadership or fire officer courses, it is not more education in any relevant fire related activity...the answer is always "Get your medic, its easy and then you are golden".
Yeah, pretty much. Fire science, Emergency Management, Pub Admin, Business Psychology, officer and instructor courses and such are useful and required more often than not once you get in. Some smaller places will require FF1 to apply, but only the golden P-card (or I-card) will get you past all the quota hiring nonsense, and basically let you "backdoor" your way in past all those in the open competitive hiring process. Not that it's right, but can you really blame someone for exploiting that opportunity? If you have a slim to none chance of getting on otherwise, you'll use the P-card, and then drop your medic status when you can promote out of it.
In my particular case, I was already in EMS for over five years when I was hired as a firemedic. I liked it, but I knew that the job wasn't sustainable for the long term wihtout better pay, benefits, schedule, job security, and working conditions. In my case I had an interest in fire. If they told me tomorrow that I had to choose to go with either strictly EMS or suppression, and still enjoy the same pay, career ladder, schedule, etc, I'd be okay with that (EMS). The money's fantastic, and we're treated better than the vast majority of single role depts. A topped out EMS tech is making more than 95k, a Lt w/ EMS cert is pulling in around 105k w/o any OT either. Where else are you going to make that kind of cash? I figured that if I didn't particularly care for fire, I could do EMS txp 100% of the time. Even if the system was full of incompetents (which it's not), I could still make my ambulance my own little world where things are done well. I can basically do the same exact job I was doing previously, and also ride a suppression unit if I want (or not).
I recently spoke to one of my cousins that still work per diem at my old hospital, NSLIJ, back home. They're running the dept in a very militant fashion, and they're really hammering people hard for things, much more than in the past. You fart and you get written up. There have been quite a few firings as well. Quite a few are going back to school to have a way out of there. This is a highly respected and desireable dept to work for. If I was still there, I'd be walking on eggshells, afraid for my job, afraid of firing or suspensions for things that formerly saw mandatory re-education. Now we have people falsifying reports, since if they told the truth, they might be fired instead of using it as a learning experience (I'm not talking about a serious medication error, but rather poor judgement calls due to inexperience or some other issue). I'd be leaving at some point myself. Even choice employers in EMS are used as a stepping stone or temporary job. Apparently I made the right choice. I had previously applied to Wake County EMS, and also Lee County EMS. Neither one called me back. It's almost comical, since I get paid way more (the cost of living drops dramatically with less than an hour commute), have many more opportunities for promotion, and enjoy a relaxed working environment with decent protocols/guidelines. No fire past recruit school if I don't want it.
You have a relativlely small number of good EMS depts, mostly in TX, WA, OR, or maybe NC from what I gather here. Otherwise, you're better off in a fire based EMS service if you want longevity. They make it easy for you to get on, that's for sure.
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I spend half of my time on an ALS engine and half on a PLS (1medic-1-Basic) Rescue ambulance. I feel that we do a very good job, almost everyone who is a medic loves the ems side because in reality most of our calls are ems or traffic accidents. I feel I have the best of both worlds and I am a very compitent medic and a very compitent fireman.
If it is new to transport for OFD believe me they will learn fast that a lot more goes on from the scene to the ER and they will indoubtebly change their on scene practices and also become better medics through transporting patients. I am Pro Fire based EMS and think it should be done right and if you do not take you medic skills seriously you shoould not be allowed to operate as one. I think it cuts out the redendancy of having multiple agencies on scene. But I am also a west coast Phoenix/LA type of system and we have not known any different out here so I can't compare it to back east where there is an obvious divide.
If it is new to transport for OFD believe me they will learn fast that a lot more goes on from the scene to the ER and they will indoubtebly change their on scene practices and also become better medics through transporting patients. I am Pro Fire based EMS and think it should be done right and if you do not take you medic skills seriously you shoould not be allowed to operate as one. I think it cuts out the redendancy of having multiple agencies on scene. But I am also a west coast Phoenix/LA type of system and we have not known any different out here so I can't compare it to back east where there is an obvious divide.
I'm of the opinion that EMS ought to be run by a municipal agency. Whether it's fire based dual role or single role, or third service matters not. I'm for the service that takes the best care of it's employees. Really, who cares about anything else if you're only going to last a few years or maybe five before you're burnt and want to leave? Aggressive protocol this, medic mill that, salary, IFT integrated or not, career advancement opportunities or lack thereof, does it really matter if the average employee tenure is five years or less? The best system is the one that you can do your entire career at, and be happy. That varies from person to person, but favoring one doesn't mean that you can $hit over all the others. I may not particularly care for the privates, but I don't look down on those that work for them. I don't look down on a lower paying third service EMS because we're well taken care of. If someone passes a derogatory comment toward fire based EMS, I think about how much better I have it now rather than at my old hospital, and my old municipal third service, and laugh a little. Maybe it's because I've never experienced the fire-to-EMS bashing when I was non-fire EMS. I'd never heard of it before joining the forum. Except for FDNY-FDNY EMS.
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How about the one that takes the best care of its patients? I've got it better at hospital-based EMS than my previous fire service gig.
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Really, if you had the option to change employers, and do the same job for maybe 50-100% more money, with better benefits and job satisfaction, you wouldn't do it? Many depts will let you stay on an ambulance all the time if you wanted to. You only really need to see fire in the academy, and the only live burns are controlled, so you have no fear of getting killed before you graduate. How many on this forum will still be in EMS full time in five years? Might as well get the best deal for yourself if you're planning to be in it for the long haul. Once you get out of the Carolinas, fire/EMS pays way better than EMS only.
BTW, Alexandria Fire and EMS in VA still hires EMS only employees. They work a 24/48/24/96. Two days out of eight. Have your cake and eat it too! Just sayin'.
BTW, Alexandria Fire and EMS in VA still hires EMS only employees. They work a 24/48/24/96. Two days out of eight. Have your cake and eat it too! Just sayin'.
Like I said, what one's idea of the ideal service is may differ from others. If you're happier at the hospital, then it was the right choice for you. Like I said, who takes the best care of their patients and everything else is a moot point if you seperate yourself from them. If management or policy changes make the hospital EMS career undesireable and you leave, you're not going to care how they handle their patients afterward. Of course you're not going to work for a system that treats their pts like crap, but for the long haul, what the dept can do for you is going to be the most important. You can work for a service full of disgruntled individuals, but you can make your ambulance a pt care utopia.
I also worked for hospital based EMS. They did NYC 911, and aggressive IFT, depending on the shift. They had the best equipment, great pay, etc. Pt care, QA/QI and such were held to lofty standards. They didn't offer much for retirement, career advancement was nearly non-existent, and they were very militant. I left for greener pastures. They could have the most cutting edge everything, but I still wouldn't have stayed without a pension, DROP, and other benefits comparable to what I have now. Taking care of my family was more important. What they've done since I've left is irrelevant to me.
I agree with 46 on every point. Except out here even on rescues you are still FF's and if arriving within the first 3 or so companies on the fire ground you are either assigned to attach to an engine company or to stand by a IRIC until on-deck is established then at that time you join that company. So we still fight fire even off the ambo's/rescues