Big day for EMS in Orlando!

[sir.shocksalot]

I'm not sure how this evolved into a fire vs ems discussion. Regardless, my condolences to the citizens of Orlando, I work in a system with an abysmal Fire-based ALS engine service so I understand the pain of an awful fire service taking over transport. And to the firefighters posting in this thread, it's not about how great your service or even how great you are as a medic, It's that your wonderful union that has given you your wonderful jobs continues to put good paramedics out of work who don't want or can't be firefighters.
Personally I have no desire to be a firefighter, I don't want to wear the silly pants or hat, I don't want to ride in a big red truck. I want to be a Paramedic and provide medical care to people in need, I detest that if I want to do that as a career (which I won't because of the fire service) I must be a hosemonkey to make a reasonable wage.
This isn't a dig at either of you or your services, honestly I have seen some amazing fire services and amazing fire medics, and I believe just being on here implies that both of you belong in that group. It's just that your union is hell-bent on taking over ambulance services and it results in large amounts of Paramedics who are EMT-Ps for the sole purpose to ride on an engine. There are just too many medics running around that are happy with their heads stuck up their a$$ in regards to any functional knowledge of medicine.

 

[TransportJockey]

I agree with 46 on every point. Except out here even on rescues you are still FF's and if arriving within the first 3 or so companies on the fire ground you are either assigned to attach to an engine company or to stand by a IRIC until on-deck is established then at that time you join that company. So we still fight fire even off the ambo's/rescues

Then that's one service I would hate to work for. I am not afraid of fighting fires, but to me it seems boring. I'd much rather work only medical. I have no desire to ever run into a burning building. I think I'm glad TX has a plethora of third service EMS (including my employer)

 

[46Young]

I'm not sure how this evolved into a fire vs ems discussion. Regardless, my condolences to the citizens of Orlando, I work in a system with an abysmal Fire-based ALS engine service so I understand the pain of an awful fire service taking over transport. And to the firefighters posting in this thread, it's not about how great your service or even how great you are as a medic, It's that your wonderful union that has given you your wonderful jobs continues to put good paramedics out of work who don't want or can't be firefighters.
Personally I have no desire to be a firefighter, I don't want to wear the silly pants or hat, I don't want to ride in a big red truck. I want to be a Paramedic and provide medical care to people in need, I detest that if I want to do that as a career (which I won't because of the fire service) I must be a hosemonkey to make a reasonable wage.
This isn't a dig at either of you or your services, honestly I have seen some amazing fire services and amazing fire medics, and I believe just being on here implies that both of you belong in that group. It's just that your union is hell-bent on taking over ambulance services and it results in large amounts of Paramedics who are EMT-Ps for the sole purpose to ride on an engine. There are just too many medics running around that are happy with their heads stuck up their a$$ in regards to any functional knowledge of medicine.

When I enrolled in medic school, I had no intention at the time to leave either that hospital, or the NYC 911 system in general. But like you said, you must be a "hosemonkey" to make a reasonable wage in most cases. I didn't see myself making it more than ten years total in that system, regardless if it was for the hospital, or FDNY EMS. The way I see it, I had no choice but to look for a high paying, well benefitted fire job if I wanted to do EMS as a permanent career choice.

The way it went for me is probably how it went/will go for many others: After getting my EMT cert, I was willing to take a per diem job anywhere, even just IFT, no matter how horrible the company, just to use as a resume builder. After getting hired there, I turned my attention to the hospitals, to get better pay, benefits, and also to do NYC 911, which was the most important consideration at the time. After getting there, I wanted to go ALS to do more for my pts, and also to have access to OT and per diem work. Later on, I came to realize that I would retire poor, as I didn't make enough to really achieve any of my retirement goals. I needed a pension and job security. That's when the game changes. Either you're going to get a degree in something else, or you're going to look for the place that's going to take care of you the best. At some point that becomes the most important. Running high call volume, walking on eggshells around management, no career advancement, and not enough money eventually gets old.

You're right, the fire service has been taking over EMS in a lot of places. I don't see that as any different than the private companies, such as Rural Metro, AMR, and the like that seek to do the same. If they could, they would run everything. It's just that the fire service has more muscle than the privates and single role EMS in general in most places. If you lived in a place that always had fire based EMS (like it is here in much of Northern VA), and you had the opportunity to campaign for a seperate EMS dept, at the cost of FF jobs, you wouldn't work towards that? How about the privates that attempt to move in on municipal EMS, fire based or otherwise? It goes both ways. It's just that the fire service has the most power at the moment.

 

[46Young]

Then that's one service I would hate to work for. I am not afraid of fighting fires, but to me it seems boring. I'd much rather work only medical. I have no desire to ever run into a burning building. I think I'm glad TX has a plethora of third service EMS (including my employer)

Mine's a little different. We carry our bunkers, our Scott packs, masks, survivor lights, box lights, and a married pair on our ambulances. We won't go interior in most cases, but we will help the engine driver hook up to a hydrant, throw ladders, and maybe stretch a line. We're not dressed, though, and we've already loaded up our cot before we began to help out. We're always ready to take any pts. The only time we get dressed is if we have a high rise fire, since rehab is two floors below the fire. We may also get dressed to make a grab at a structure fire if no one else is around, which practically never happens.

 

[TransportJockey]

Mine's a little different. We carry our bunkers, our Scott packs, masks, survivor lights, box lights, and a married pair on our ambulances. We won't go interior in most cases, but we will help the engine driver hook up to a hydrant, throw ladders, and maybe stretch a line. We're not dressed, though, and we've already loaded up our cot before we began to help out. We're always ready to take any pts. The only time we get dressed is if we have a high rise fire, since rehab is two floors below the fire. We may also get dressed to make a grab at a structure fire if no one else is around, which practically never happens.

That doesn't sound like it'd be too bad.

 

[usalsfyre]

46young, it's nothing personal at all. My beef is with the IAFF's tech school approach to medicine (it wasn't too long ago that the state made FFXCO remove the word "paramedic from their apparatus because more as often as not they only had I's on board) and it's Borg-like propensity for taking over well functioning systems and replacing the with often dysfunctional EMS-hating forced to be paramedic (or I99) providers.

Some of the best medics I've ever known are firemedics. One works right up the road from you in the city, another was an EMS Lt on I believe 425 at one point. They're the exception though, not the rule.

OTOH, if I was ever to go back to NOVA, Alex FD EMS would be my #1 place to go. Those guys have got it going on.

 

[46Young]

46young, it's nothing personal at all. My beef is with the IAFF's tech school approach to medicine (it wasn't too long ago that the state made FFXCO remove the word "paramedic from their apparatus because more as often as not they only had I's on board) and it's Borg-like propensity for taking over well functioning systems and replacing the with often dysfunctional EMS-hating forced to be paramedic (or I99) providers.

Some of the best medics I've ever known are firemedics. One works right up the road from you in the city, another was an EMS Lt on I believe 425 at one point. They're the exception though, not the rule.

Yes, I've seen those political takeovers on the news from time to time. I've said in past discussions that I don't agree with putting single role providers out of work for those reasons. We still have the I-99's pretty much functioning the same as medics, but we're upgrading everyone to EMT-P through NOVA CC. And yes, the fire service in general sees an EMT-P cert as just another specialty, like TROT or Hazmat. I've seen a divide between those of the suppression only mindset and those with a primarily EMS standpoint. I think that much of that over here is from the medics being paid a lot more, that we're given extra promotional points for having the ALS cert, and that a good number of our upper admin are also medics. The more recent ALS hires of the past five years or so have demonstrated themselves to be quite competent, like riding the box, and more than a few already have EMS degrees. This should help in the next 10-15 years or so when we progress up in rank. I've also seen some current medic Lt's and EMS Capt's that don't have a clue. You make 100k + a year and you're miserable and can't be bothered to educate yourself past the EMT-I mill program you took back in1986? WTF?

The Quaterhouse (425) runs some good EMS, less BS than some other areas.

 

[46Young]

That doesn't sound like it'd be too bad.

We're crosstrained, but the dept keeps it's EMS and suppression deployments seperate and dedicated to their respective roles. We can take the engine medic whenever we want, but that's about the extent of pulling people from their riding assignments.

 

[MrBrown]

Aw man, the IAFF strike again. Man these guys are worse than the bloody borg.

Brown ran into a Firemedic who was unable to tell Brown which sided heart faiure causes pulmonary edema. Hmm ........

 

[usalsfyre]

Aw man, the IAFF strike again. Man these guys are worse than the bloody borg.

Brown ran into a Firemedic who was unable to tell Brown which sided heart faiure causes pulmonary edema. Hmm ........

Brown, unfortunately it's not just firemedics who couldn't tell you this, I know quite a few single-role providers who would give a glazed over stare and a full minute of silence broken only by "you mean just one side of the heart can fail?!?!?".

 

[46Young]

Aw man, the IAFF strike again. Man these guys are worse than the bloody borg.

Brown ran into a Firemedic who was unable to tell Brown which sided heart faiure causes pulmonary edema. Hmm ........

Some region fed by the LAD or LCX? We learned that in EMT-B school.

 

[Motojunkie]

Among other instances, medics have asked me what the requirements for STEMI are, and have tried to pass off a guy having a STEMI as BLS.

It's not so much that I have a problem with them transporting, it's that none of them wants to do it so their going to be lax with their care or try and pass a pt off to us. I worked yesterday and asked them each time we had a call if they were ready/wanted to transport- no every single time.