Starting Paramedic.... Need to knows!?!?

[MrJones]

Weeding out should never be the goal of anyone in a educational or training role. All the professions you mentioned above have substantial clinical aspects to them after their formal didactic period. EMS does not, hence the importance of the being a basic and getting some experience. It's not perfect, and in reality, the clinical/field/whatever should be changed but since so much of EMS is subject to what market forces will allow, things get abbreviated. It should also be kept in mind that the EMS level with the exception of basic are all really designed to build on former training and experience.

I can't see someone skipping union apprentice and jumping straight to journeyman.

Allow me to rephrase slightly

...if the clinical/internship/testing process isn't effectively training candidates to be medics, perhaps the clinical/internship/testing process should be fixed.

Doesn't change my point a bit, but should be more palatable to those of you who believe that "Weeding out should never be the goal of anyone in a educational or training role"(another concept that I pretty much disagree with, btw. But that's a discussion for another time and place).

 

[Jambi]

Doesn't change my point a bit, but should be more palatable to those of you who believe that "Weeding out should never be the goal of anyone in a educational or training role"(another concept that I pretty much disagree with, btw. But that's a discussion for another time and place).

Don't get me wrong here. If someone proves incompetent, then so be it. But if failure rates are high in a course of education be it in the classroom or in the field, the real issue comes down to selection process. Lots of people get into paramedic school that do not belong there because of a lack of selection process, thus requiring EMT experience serves as a barrier into a program. While that is backwards, it's one of the few that the profession usually has the balls to require.

 

[MrJones]

Don't get me wrong here. If someone proves incompetent, then so be it. But if failure rates are high in a course of education be it in the classroom or in the field, the real issue comes down to selection process. Lots of people get into paramedic school that do not belong there because of a lack of selection process, thus requiring EMT experience serves as a barrier into a program. While that is backwards, it's one of the few that the profession usually has the balls to require.

Now we're getting somewhere. So the question now becomes how else could potential medics be screened prior to beginning training? Is requiring XX amount of time as an EMT the most effective method? How much experience as an EMT is adequate? And - most important in my book - who determines that a particular EMT isn't a good candidate for medic training? Using what objective criteria? In my mind, simply requiring XX amount of time does/will not keep incompetent EMTs from becoming incompetent medics; a major source of my disdain for the requirement as currently enforced in some jurisdictions.

 

[firetender]

Now we're getting somewhere. So the question now becomes how else could potential medics be screened prior to beginning training? Is requiring XX amount of time as an EMT the most effective method? How much experience as an EMT is adequate? And - most important in my book - who determines that a particular EMT isn't a good candidate for medic training? Using what objective criteria? In my mind, simply requiring XX amount of time does/will not keep incompetent EMTs from becoming incompetent medics; a major source of my disdain for the requirement as currently enforced in some jurisdictions.

When I started posting here I was an adamant proponent of mandatory couple-of-years EMT experience before being allowed to begin a paramedic program. I based this mostly on the idea of gaining mastery of the basic skills sets of scene management, patient evaluation, management and transport, along with establishing rapport with ancillary staff. These little building blocks, when mastered, allow you to integrate more advanced skills incrementally.

As years went by, and seeing plenty of evidence here on this site to show that a lot of people going direct from EMT school to paramedic did okay, I softened it a bit.

But you bring up a good point because requiring a couple years in the field EMT experience will usually squeeze out those who are not suited to emergency work at any level.

When would you prefer to figure that out? While the guy/gal's running Basic, or in the midst of an Advanced call?

And that makes me wonder: Just how many basics going straight into paramedic flame out within the first year? Now a study of that would give us some solid info to work with. I'll go so far as to bet you a buck the proportion would be higher than either of us suspect!

To this point, all we have here are opinions and guesses, and anecdotal evidence, including mine!

So perhaps that's something you Newbies should consider very seriously; are you absolutely SURE that EMS is something you not only CAN do based on schooling alone, but REALLY want to do? Medic school takes time and money and thrusts you into a working world where the stakes are human lives. It's all very romantic but honestly, are you sure you can handle it?

Some can. Many here do. But there are just as many who just had to spend a couple days studying this site to figure out, man this is some SERIOUS :censored::censored::censored::censored:! and are never heard from again.

 

[Jambi]

Now we're getting somewhere. So the question now becomes how else could potential medics be screened prior to beginning training? Is requiring XX amount of time as an EMT the most effective method? How much experience as an EMT is adequate? And - most important in my book - who determines that a particular EMT isn't a good candidate for medic training? Using what objective criteria? In my mind, simply requiring XX amount of time does/will not keep incompetent EMTs from becoming incompetent medics; a major source of my disdain for the requirement as currently enforced in some jurisdictions.

Prerequisites, just like nursing...if I had my way I'd require a year of A&P, Microbiology (or a semester of general biology), a semester of chemistry, psych, Freshman English, and intermediate or college algebra. I think that would kill most academic issues students may have. I would also require at least a year of EMT experience so people can get a general idea of the field, get used to being in an ambulance, and most importantly, acclimate to working with patients.

 

[Jambi]

And that makes me wonder: Just how many basics going straight into paramedic flame out within the first year? Now a study of that would give us some solid info to work with. I'll go so far as to bet you a buck the proportion would be higher than either of us suspect!

This also brings up yet one more big problem with EMS, no meaningful statistical tracking of educational programs. There are first time pass rate tracking, but that's really it.

There needs to be tracking of students at all levels of entry with an attempt to correlate all relevant data to success rates, including entry requirements, education levels, years of experience, etc. I believe all the major medical professions do this.

 

[MrJones]

Gents - this is becoming an interesting conversation, but I wonder if it isn't straying a bit from the original topic. Does it deserve its own thread?

 

[Jambi]

Gents - this is becoming an interesting conversation, but I wonder if it isn't straying a bit from the original topic. Does it deserve its own thread?

you are 100% correct

 

[firetender]

Slipped the track!

I have never been in this class or career field until recently. I would like to ask everyone of there own opinions on what was difficult for them in this class and what helped them overcome that problem? Any helpful hints or tips would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

My bad as well...let's get back to the OP's original request.

hanks!

 

[rodz77]

Ok so back to the original question...
I recently finished Medic class and even more recent, like "this week" took and passed registry 1st time.
I was licensed as EMT-B in '07, never worked an actual job as an EMT, did EMT side jobs here and there thru the years. Enter Medic school, where most of my classmates were "sponsored" by their respective agencies to go thru it. I do have a Kinisiology college degree, so thankfully that helped me tons on my A&P, EKG, and medical terminology. In fact I did better than most of my classmates on the didactic portion. Even clinicals were not too bad, nurses really helped me learn the basic equipment. Then came Field, where I fell way behind. Mind you, I had to spend time learning just the ambulance and where things were and what everything was for all while trying to run calls, remember what every medication is for and all of my protocols and be a "leader." It was extremely difficult. My classmates on the other hand knew ambulance operations in and out and for the most part knew the protocols pretty well because of their experience and seeing it all day at work. They have been around the circuit long enough to even know what kind of things to look for, listen for, and ask. Although I eventually got thru it I sure was lost for a bit....
It is do-able, don't get me wrong. You may have to work a little harder at it than most and any and all experience you can gain before you enter class will help. Study hard, drugs are tough especially if you have no experience with them like me. But never give up if this is truly something you have a passion for. I am an example that it can be achieved you just have to work a little harder at it. After 16yrs with my company I will now be following my passion and transitioning full time into the EMS field. I'm happy!

 

[AnthonyTheEmt]

Ok so back to the original question...
I recently finished Medic class and even more recent, like "this week" took and passed registry 1st time.
I was licensed as EMT-B in '07, never worked an actual job as an EMT, did EMT side jobs here and there thru the years. Enter Medic school, where most of my classmates were "sponsored" by their respective agencies to go thru it. I do have a Kinisiology college degree, so thankfully that helped me tons on my A&P, EKG, and medical terminology. In fact I did better than most of my classmates on the didactic portion. Even clinicals were not too bad, nurses really helped me learn the basic equipment. Then came Field, where I fell way behind. Mind you, I had to spend time learning just the ambulance and where things were and what everything was for all while trying to run calls, remember what every medication is for and all of my protocols and be a "leader." It was extremely difficult. My classmates on the other hand knew ambulance operations in and out and for the most part knew the protocols pretty well because of their experience and seeing it all day at work. They have been around the circuit long enough to even know what kind of things to look for, listen for, and ask. Although I eventually got thru it I sure was lost for a bit....
It is do-able, don't get me wrong. You may have to work a little harder at it than most and any and all experience you can gain before you enter class will help. Study hard, drugs are tough especially if you have no experience with them like me. But never give up if this is truly something you have a passion for. I am an example that it can be achieved you just have to work a little harder at it. After 16yrs with my company I will now be following my passion and transitioning full time into the EMS field. I'm happy!

This story is exactly why I think that people who want to go to medic school should have experience. This guy passed with none, but would be willing to guess that he is the exception, not the rule. Not to mention, people who go from EMT to medic with no experience may not actually like the job. I firmly believe that this is the kind of field you have to be passionate about, otherwise your patients will suffer for it. And not having any experience, you may start out and find either A) you are not passionate about it/hate it or B) realize you cannot handle seeing some of the horrible things that most of us see on a regular basis. Not at all bashing any else's opinion. Just my .02

 

[leoemt]

Haha I get told every once in awhile by Basics to wait and others think I should do it. So on that note I am still going back and forth. I completely understand the difference between the classroom and the in field experience. The main thing for me is my instructor from my basic class is also the instructor for medic. He has told me on numerous occasions that he is confident in me and thinks I will do fine. I really want to not only be a good student but my main goal is to be a good medic and I understand by doing good in class and passing the test does not mean that at all.

I am a Basic and a new one at that. However, what I can tell you from my Paramedic friends is Paramedic school EXPECTS a certain level of knowledge and skill prior to going into class. They don't cover CPR, vitals, or anything like that. You are expected to know that prior to entering school.

You may very well succeed going straight to medic. You may also bomb out in the first week.

What I want to know is why rush the process? Paramedics will always be needed. You might even be more marketable as a medic if you show field experience as a Basic. I know several companies around me at least want you to have prior EMT experience before they will hire you for either Basic or Medic.

Book work is book work. Acing medic school does not translate into you being a good medic. Good medics are ones that think outside the box and don't rely on "the book". I have seen both basics and medics fail even though they breezed through school.

I don't know why you want to be a medic so bad. What I do know is whether your a Basic or a Medic, the patients' needs should be your priority.

Regardless of what you do, I wish you the best of luck and hope you succeed.

 

[blachatch]

^^^^ Ill speak for myself rushing into medic.. There are only private transport companies that will hire a basic. A private transport company around the northeast ohio are will not run 911 calls none! You will not get much experience transporting people from hospital to hospital in my opinion. So alot of people just go right to medic.

 

[stagejedi]

Medical math was difficult as was some of the patho stuff. For the math my advice would be to get the book "the 4 step method of drug calculation" for the patho stuff try to look up animations of things that confuse you (Sodium Potasium pump, action potential and muscle contraction ect) On youtube

 

[crashh]

Good luck!

I too have just begun my Paramedic schooling. In my program it's condensed down to 11 months. I have only been an EMT-B for 5 months, so I am going to be hitting it hard as well!

 

[GaMedic]

Good luck man, its going to be a tough road. I kinda agree with the whole get some experience before jumping into the fire. The reason I say this is because every call prepares you for the next. Without having that experience to fall back on you are selling yourself short, having that field experience that can save your *** or your pt's ***. Sadly people don't present textbook every time. I have lost count at the calls I have ran that I was like WTF... Then after evaluating the pt been like "Ah hell I have seen this before" which in several cases increased the pts likely hood of having a favorable outcome.

One of the biggest things to remember is you may not always be on a double medic truck and if you are not. You don't have anyone to look to and be like "hey boss whatcha think?" You are that guy, who will be looked to for questions.. Which you can always call medical control but the last thing you want to do is get to the point that medical control loses faith in your ability to perform the job.

Good luck!!

 

[usalsfyre]

Here's some issue with the "couple of years experience" requirement. A basic will end up in one of two places, on a double basic unit or a P/B configuration. Let's explore each of these.

If placed on a double basic unit it's very likely the candidate or their partner won't have the necessary knowledge to gain anything from the experience. Without educational background you've got to be able to retroactively apply knowledge gained to situations you've seen in the past (not easy to do) or there's no value to the situation. Theres a reason medical schools put two years of didactic education in front of clinical rotations. It's not educational to see something and not know what it is.

So the alternative is a Medic/Basic truck. In theory the medic should be able to "apprentice" the basic and prepare him for school. IF (big if) you get a medic that's knowledgable enough to teach (its probably 50/50 at best) and is willing to educate (which is an even smaller number). In reality what you end up with a lot of the time is the "FNG" is paired up with a "salty" veteran who stopped learning circa 1995 and does his best to ingrain bad habits in a new EMT.

 

[crashh]

I hope I'm not making a big mistake :unsure: I'm really excited about this step forward and have a lot of support. I have been an emt a short time, but have been very active and eager to learn. I'll keep you updated!

any tips would be appreciated!