Snake Bite Talk

[Mountain Res-Q]

Interested in any Snake Bite stories out there. I know that actual deaths from snake bites (at least in the USA) are rare, but strikes are not. My county sees quite a few bites every year and snakes have always fascinated me.

What venomous snakes in your area?

Any interesting stories?

What treatments are you doing in your area?

Any other interesting venomous creature stories in your area?

http://www.uniondemocrat.com/200907...reminders-to-use-caution-in-rattler-territory

 

[Flight-LP]

Lots of copperhead and cottonmouth bites around here. Most are treated for pain only with few systemic effects. We will see an occasional coralsnake and rattlesnake bite, and these usually are the only ones that are "treated". Crofab is readily available, but not used as much around Houston as it used to be. Risk vs. benefit I guess.

 

[Seaglass]

Lots of copperheads here, and the occasional cottonmouth or timber rattler. Cases where someone doesn't know what bit them are pretty common, but it's generally assumed it was a copperhead, since they're a lot more common.

Copperhead bites are just observed, since they dry-bite pretty often. I've even heard that the allergy rate to the antivenin is higher than the actual rate of bites with venom. At any rate, CroFab is available in the area, though it's rarely given.

I've had plenty of experience to support that copperheads aren't aggressive. We had a lot around the house where I grew up, and I tried to keep some as pets when I was very little. Never got bitten... although I'm sure I would've deserved it.

We've also got both brown recluses and black widows. I don't know of any healthy adults who've died from bites, but they're still pretty nasty. Treatment consists of an ice pack and driving to the hospital as far as we're concerned. They tend to show up in urgent care more often, though.

Beyond those, we've also got all kinds of diseases that can be transmitted by the local bugs and animals. Rabies, Lyme, West Nile, you name it... we now supposedly have CWD too, just for extra fun.

 

[CAOX3]

Whoa I dont like snakes, and why do people keep snakes that can eat their children?

 

[mycrofft]

Once bitten twice shy

Late in one afternoon a big, young and not too bright or mature guy comes in with a bandage on his forearm, and says "I think I was bitten by a snake". Ok, we take vitals, remove bandage, and see two puncture marks about 3/4 inch apart on his volar forearm, the area is reddened and swollen and a little dusky near the punctures.

Hmmm.:glare:

When asked if he saw the snake or how this happened he gets sorta vague, then allows as how it was "just under a bush, that's all", and was a "baby rattler".

He is in good shape, having lotsa kilograms per milligrams of venom, but the arm is starting to swell somewhat. Our "doc in a box" had rattler antivenin, the doctor explained patiently that he needed treatment started promptly in the form of invections (antivenin and tetanus)..

"No needles!! No needles!!" the pt shouts, brushes us off and runs out the side doors.

Three days later he's back, feels very unwell, entire forearm swollen, dusky, and there's a deep nasty ulcer around the bite site. The pt says yes to the antivenin, but the doctor explains it is too late just for that, he will need to be transported to the hospital and that we need to start an IV now to help him feel better (and in case he crumped before the squad could come take him away).

"No needles!! No needles!!" and we never saw him again.

(Note: lotsa cranksters around there, and many of them kept and still keep reptiles, including the plentiful local rattlers. A few li bites are recorded every yuear, and guess how those happen).<_<

 

[mycrofft]

Seaglass, you sound like you're in the Ozarks!

All you need are centipedes and scorpions and you have most of the common envenomators all wrapped up.

 

[usafmedic45]

When I was still working in EMS for pay (I was actually just getting off work when the call came in so rode out with the oncoming EMS supervisor then stuck around the ED after we arrived to see what would happen as this is something I will likely never see again thankfully), we had some numbskull who was bitten by his "pet" Gaboon viper which he was in posession of illegally. The cops never did find out exactly how he got ahold of it; the question I wanted answered more was WHY he wanted to own the snake with the longest fangs on the planet. A cool looking snake, they are not supposed to be (and I quote the guy from the zoo we called to ask about this) "particularly aggressive" but I think that's a relative term for a predator that pretty much operates off instinct and reflex.

Suffice to say he died a very horrible death with spontaneous hemorrhage into his head, under the skin from even the lightest touch, his abdomen and the compartments of his extremities. He was seizing and that was preceded by fasciculations along with this generalized edema that slowly spread from the site of the bite on his left forearm to include almost his entire body. It ranks up there with the most disturbing things I have ever witnessed. He had the misfortune of getting bitten on the same day as a really major snowstorm going through the area which hampered the ability to transfer him to a more suitable hospital or to bring in antivenom. Several hours after the bite he died after his brain herniated secondary to massive intracranial hemorrhage.

 

[bmennig]

While I never had to take a snake bite pt, It's always a possibly out here in the backwoods where I'm at. It's a call you tend to forget about until you get it, then it's an "oh sh**" moment.

 

[MendoEMT]

Actually had a discussion the other day about snakes. For some reason all our ambulances had snake bite kits (venom extractors and other junk) even though those have been out of vogue for some time and our protocols don't let us use them.......

 

[Seaglass]

Whoa I dont like snakes, and why do people keep snakes that can eat their children?

My parents didn't let me. I knew they wouldn't approve, so I'd smuggle them into the house.

All you need are centipedes and scorpions and you have most of the common envenomators all wrapped up.

Not the Ozarks, but yeah, we have lots of poisonous critters in common. We only had snakes until a few years ago, when we started getting poisonous spiders for some reason or another.

I've lived in places with lots of scorpions before, but never saw a sting. Are there any poisonous centipedes in the US? I don't recall hearing about anyone being bitten before...

 

[mycrofft]

All centipedes are poisonous, some are too small to count.

My understanding is the venom acts like the common scorpion venom (referring to domestic varieties of each and excluding the Mojave green scorpion). If the centipede can get it's venom claws through your skin, it can sting. If it tries but fails and you react to the chemicals in it, you might get a little welt.
I saw a guy whose buddy put a little millipede into his sock. When it was partially crushed it released a mild irritant toxin and tiny millipede-shaped welt on the inmate's foot. Dx was by finding the pissed-off dying critter in the sock, about 1 cm long.

The larger millipedes will smell musty and this repellent apparently can be irritating to eyes and tender skin.

Oh, everyone remember "red on yeller, kill a feller; red on black, venom lack"?

 

[Sasha]

Oh, everyone remember "red on yeller, kill a feller; red on black, venom lack"?

I always heard it "Red on yellow will kill a fellow, red on black is a friend of jack" although I never figured out who jack was

 

[HotelCo]

I remember it as "When red touches yellow, you're a dead fellow. When red touched black, you're OK Jack."

 

[Mountain Res-Q]

I remember it as "When red touches yellow, you're a dead fellow. When red touched black, you're OK Jack."

Has no one ever heard "When you see a snake, pee yourself, and run away screaming like a girl"?

Not that I have ever done that.

My most interesting snake story comes from my Vet Tech years. In Vet Medicine we see a lot of snake bites, mostly because dogs go where they ought not and stick their noses where they ought not. About 6-7 years ago we saw a Doxie with every s/s of an envenomation, but no localized swealling that we could see and no puncture site that we could see. So we treated like an allergic reaction and observed... after several hours of the dog not improving and seeming to get worse, someone had the idea to check the mouth; the only area on the dog that we could not (he was not having it and was very agressive). Welll of course he was... it was painful. After some general anesthesia we opened the mouth and found that the tounge was three-four times it's normal size with two puncture marks right in front. Now, don't ask me what set of circumstances could lead to any creature getting a snike bite to the tounge...

Oh, and in case you are wondering... treated with steroids, antihystamines, abs, and fluid therapy... dog died that night. Anti-venom (at least at the versions we had back then) were a long shot at having any useful effects (and were expensive - $600+).

 

[Sasha]

Has no one ever heard "When you see a snake, pee yourself, and run away screaming like a girl"?

Not that I have ever done that.

My most interesting snake story comes from my Vet Tech years. In Vet Medicine we see a lot of snake bites, mostly because dogs go where they ought not and stick their noses where they ought not. About 6-7 years ago we saw a Doxie with every s/s of an envenomation, but no localized swealling that we could see and no puncture site that we could see. So we treated like an allergic reaction and observed... after several hours of the dog not improving and seeming to get worse, someone had the idea to check the mouth; the only area on the dog that we could not (he was not having it and was very agressive). Welll of course he was... it was painful. After some general anesthesia we opened the mouth and found that the tounge was three-four times it's normal size with two puncture marks right in front. Now, don't ask me what set of circumstances could lead to any creature getting a snike bite to the tounge...

Oh, and in case you are wondering... treated with steroids, antihystamines, abs, and fluid therapy... dog died that night. Anti-venom (at least at the versions we had back then) were a long shot at having any useful effects (and were expensive - $600+).

Poor puppy :[

 

[Seaglass]

My understanding is the venom acts like the common scorpion venom (referring to domestic varieties of each and excluding the Mojave green scorpion). If the centipede can get it's venom claws through your skin, it can sting. If it tries but fails and you react to the chemicals in it, you might get a little welt.
I saw a guy whose buddy put a little millipede into his sock. When it was partially crushed it released a mild irritant toxin and tiny millipede-shaped welt on the inmate's foot. Dx was by finding the pissed-off dying critter in the sock, about 1 cm long.

The larger millipedes will smell musty and this repellent apparently can be irritating to eyes and tender skin.

Oh, everyone remember "red on yeller, kill a feller; red on black, venom lack"?

Thanks. Never knew that. We have some around here, but they're mostly pretty small.

I forgot another venomous critter--killer bees. The media made a big deal about one or two being sighted in my area a few years ago, and nothing ever came of it.

And I always heard it as "red on yellow, kill a fellow." Never knew it had a second part.

 

[Fireguy]

I never had a snake bite PT(knock on wood). One night at the fire station we received a phone call for a snake in someones basement. We told them to call the state police because they would gladly handle that. The homeowner replied with a snicker, "already did and they told me to call you".

 

[Epi-do]

Supposedly, we have rattlers around here. You go to the southern part of the state and there are supposed to be cottonmouths and copperheads. I don't think they are that common though, and of the three I have only ever seen one. It was a copperhead curled up next to a rock along a trail at a state park. We gave it a wide enough berth it never even gave us a second glance.

We do have brown recluse spiders around here, and infact, I have seen several bites from them. Fortunately, none of them were severe bites.

 

[fma08]

I always heard it "Red on yellow will kill a fellow, red on black is a friend of jack" although I never figured out who jack was

Jack was the guy who lived to make up the rhyme

 

[FFMckenzie]

My understanding is the venom acts like the common scorpion venom (referring to domestic varieties of each and excluding the Mojave green scorpion). If the centipede can get it's venom claws through your skin, it can sting. If it tries but fails and you react to the chemicals in it, you might get a little welt.
I saw a guy whose buddy put a little millipede into his sock. When it was partially crushed it released a mild irritant toxin and tiny millipede-shaped welt on the inmate's foot. Dx was by finding the pissed-off dying critter in the sock, about 1 cm long.

The larger millipedes will smell musty and this repellent apparently can be irritating to eyes and tender skin.

Oh, everyone remember "red on yeller, kill a feller; red on black, venom lack"?

Are you a crew captain? why are you watching inmates putting bugs in each others shoes hmmm.

Also for coastal people dont forget jellyfish. They mostly have mild stings but they can also cause anaphylaxis.