Good Samaritan - Rescue Vs. Medical

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spinnakr

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DrParasite said:
but getting super involved in the scene once help arrives? or before help arrives? nah, let the AHJ handles patient care, documentation and deal with everything once they get on scene
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Except in situations where, as the NFPA puts it, the environment is immediately dangerous to life and health. EX: burning building, burning car, etc. Of course then, you'd be justified if you refused to help from a scene safety standpoint.

I'm hoping you caught that much of what you alluded to was sarcasm...
 
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MidwestFF

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Just to clarify my previous responses. I always keep a football size first aid kit in my vehicles with basic BSI stuff you never know when you, your kids, or someone else might need it. Unless I'm on station and my gear is there, it is normally with me. Per our local protocols if I witness something like this I am required to stop and call it in unless EMS and or Fire is already on scene.

As soon as I stop, I am on duty(read -> covered by department insurance), and therefore subject to Department SOP's and SOG's which dictate PPE based on the scene. For the scene that was described per our protocols I must at least to attempt to call the local AHJ and then don my PPE prior to getting within 100 feet of the vehicle. Our SOP's dealing with PPE requirements are fairly rigid. That type of crash scene would require per our SOP's full turnout gear, jacket, pants, boots, helmet, traffic vest, etc. If I was responding in a engine or rescue SCBA would be required as well; there is a small exception in our SOP's if responding POV and you are first on scene it is left to the individual whether there is a 'reasonable' risk vs benefit to the patients & the responder regarding mandatory SCBA use in the absence of one.

As to the question if I have ever stopped on a scene the answer is yes. My spouse is an experienced health care provider (read well beyond Medic & or floor nurse but not a MD either) and we stopped on a scene once several years ago, solo MC rider, no helmet vs guardrail and then pavement at 70+ mph. At the time we where the only other vehicle on the road and we stopped to assist. The pt had two full extremity amputations thanks to the guardrail, major closed head injury, and was generally hamburger head to toe. We called it in and did the best we could dealing with bleeding, and shock until help could arrive. We originally requested Air but it was not available due to weather conditions, 911 dispatch couldn't call for Air due to their protocols, so I called and got much further with Life-Flight direct until the closest crew declined due to weather and density altitude at our location. AHJ took almost 30 minutes to show with Fire and EMS and even then all they had were a couple of BLS providers. They wound up letting my spouse run PT care while I helped with PT packaging and loading, I followed the ambulance with my spouse in it 35+ miles to the communities Doc-In-A-Box(express sized at that) and then spent another three hours their while my spouse helped stabilize the patient so that the PT could get flown out. We learned that the PT did regain consciousness but died a few weeks later due to the head injury and massive infection due to the incident.
 
TransportJockey

TransportJockey

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I'm seeing lot o acronyms in this thread, most I know but wth is AHJ?
 
Stephanie.

Stephanie.

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DV_EMT said:
For Scene Purposes:
In order to "entrap the patient" lets say the driver lost control and hit a large boulder that has crushed the passenger side windshield and has made it impossible to access the passenger side (assuming its a 2 door coupe).
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DV_EMT said:
The Car.... to be fair to all parties, lets make it a Jeep Wrangler, 6 cylinder. with mud tires and offroad lights! There is a tow package with a D ring and or trailer hitch.
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Changed the scenario again. Therefore there is at least some access to passenger, given that they are NOT entrapped.
 
Sandog

Sandog

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MidwestFF said:
As to the question if I have ever stopped on a scene the answer is yes. My spouse is an experienced health care provider (read well beyond Medic & or floor nurse but not a MD either) and we stopped on a scene once several years ago, solo MC rider, no helmet vs guardrail and then pavement at 70+ mph. At the time we where the only other vehicle on the road and we stopped to assist. The pt had two full extremity amputations thanks to the guardrail, major closed head injury, and was generally hamburger head to toe. We called it in and did the best we could dealing with bleeding, and shock until help could arrive. We originally requested Air but it was not available due to weather conditions, 911 dispatch couldn't call for Air due to their protocols, so I called and got much further with Life-Flight direct until the closest crew declined due to weather and density altitude at our location. AHJ took almost 30 minutes to show with Fire and EMS and even then all they had were a couple of BLS providers. They wound up letting my spouse run PT care while I helped with PT packaging and loading, I followed the ambulance with my spouse in it 35+ miles to the communities Doc-In-A-Box(express sized at that) and then spent another three hours their while my spouse helped stabilize the patient so that the PT could get flown out. We learned that the PT did regain consciousness but died a few weeks later due to the head injury and massive infection due to the incident.
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Look at this way. You and your wife extended this persons life an additional two weeks. This afforded his family and friends a chance to say goodbye before passing.

You did good.
 
TransportJockey

TransportJockey

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Sandog said:
Look at this way. You and your wife extended this persons life an additional two weeks. This afforded his family and friends a chance to say goodbye before passing.

You did good.
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And let the pt and his family wrack up one hell of a medical bill
 
firetender

firetender

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A Philisophical Moment from a firetender

With each and every thing you do, each and every treatment you render, each and every thing that happens, never forget the #1 Rule of Life:

Could be good
Could be bad

(Your interpretation is what makes the difference in the moment. Long-term, whatever happens is just an initiating ripple that can morph into anything. Quit your squabbling, kids, do your honest best and enjoy the wonder, just enjoy the wonder!)
 
TransportJockey

TransportJockey

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Stephanie.

Stephanie.

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spinnakr said:
No, he was talking about your car as the responder. Also, the no entrapment was on the driver, not the passenger.
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Thank you for clarifying. My apologies.
 
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thatJeffguy

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jtpaintball70 said:
Oh hell no. You do not remove an impaled object unless it interferes with the airway. Ever. And if a patient is black, they're staying that way. You say you're a medic student? Then tell me what's the probability of getting back a trauma arrest in a trauma room, much less prehospital with no equipment.

EDIT: Just read the post you posted above this. Your post didn't sound very sarcastic. I've seen sparky new EMTs come in and post stuff exactly like that and be 100% serious :p
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This "ever" stuff is a bit much.

W-EMT teaches, and Wilderness protocols allow for, the removal of objects impaled through extremities, if they aren't near a major vessel.
 
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