What's next? Fire or Medic?

[EMTFL]

So I'm at another crossroad and I've been told so many different things, I have no clue what to do.

My goal is Firefighter Medic. However, I'm not sure if I should go to fire school first, then medic, or attempt medic, then fire.

Here in Florida I hear that they have such a shortage of medics, you might not even need your fire; the medic training itself is your golden ticket.

Others say no, get your fire certification, and then attempt to get a Fire EMT position; but then I hear that fire departments get hundreds of applications for EMT Firefighter every month.

Where should I go from here? Medic of Fire? What are your opinions?

Thanks guys

 

[daedalus]

Do you want to be a firefighter? Or, do you want to be a paramedic who is committed to spending the rest of your life learning and re-learning medicine?

Not many of us here are friendly to the idea of FF/Medic.

 

[VentMedic]

Here in Florida I hear that they have such a shortage of medics, you might not even need your fire; the medic training itself is your golden ticket.

That may be true north of Orlando. The FDs in the southern half of the state have more than their share of applicants who are already both FF and Paramedic certified.



1. Are you just wanting a job with the FD for the benefits?

or

2. Do you want to be a Fire Fighter but knows that one must also be a Paramedic to get hired?

or

3. Do you want to be a medical professional?

 

[Sasha]

Orange County and Oviedo Fire are the only two I've seen that you don't need fire to get hired, but you still must pass the same PAT.

Get your fire. Where are you located? Ask some of your local stations, but I would recommend getting your fire cert. You can find shift friendly medic schools a lot easier than you can find shift friendly fire schools, and if you wait long enough a lot of fire stations will put you through medic school, some, like Apopka FD down in Central Florida, have their own in house Medic school.

Also like to add that OCFD only took non fire medics because Rural Metro lost their Orange County transport contract, so they put all the non fire medics on roaming trucks in 12 hour shifts, and they get paid significantly less than fire medics.

 

[VentMedic]

Orange County and Oviedo Fire are the only two I've seen that you don't need fire to get hired, but you still must pass the same PAT.

Get your fire. Where are you located? Ask some of your local stations, but I would recommend getting your fire cert. You can find shift friendly medic schools a lot easier than you can find shift friendly fire schools, and if you wait long enough a lot of fire stations will put you through medic school, some, like Apopka FD down in Central Florida, have their own in house Medic school.

Also like to add that OCFD only took non fire medics because Rural Metro lost their Orange County transport contract, so they put all the non fire medics on roaming trucks in 12 hour shifts, and they get paid significantly less than fire medics.

Okay BossyCow, it is my area and the administration. (reference from another thread)

I think Sasha has just covered many of the problems faced in Florida and other Fire based EMS regions.

 

[pumper12fireman]

First, go to fire school. Decide if you like emergency services and being an FF/EMT. If you do enjoy it, and make it, then you can make an informed decision based off experience. I will be honest, I went to medic too soon. I did not realize how MUCH responsibility lies within a medic's hands. It made for a tough learning curve. Secondly, DO NOT become a medic to get a fire job. Worst mistake you can make.

 

[akflightmedic]

Didn't you have some driving issues or was that someone else?

Also, weren't you looking to relocate or was that someone else as well?

If you are indeed the same person from the questions above, you have a lot of focusing to do. You need to sit down and figure out exactly what it is you want to do.

Do you want to move or do you want to go to school. If you go to school, will someone hire you afterwards with your driving record?

EMT/FFs are a dime a dozen in FL, and the majority of them have clean records.

Find your path, then ask us, but right now you are steering all over the road.

 

[EMTFL]

Yes, that was me.

Essentially I want to be a firefighter. I believe I would enjoy medic, but I can't say for certain since I haven't worked as an EMT yet. And truthfully, I don't want to hold such a huge responsibility and be the one "in charge" right now (obviously).

I DO want to relocate, but I only want to relocate so that I can start my medical career. I know it sounds silly to relocate across the country for a job that might only pay $10/hour, but sometimes, you have to start somewhere. I was hoping to land a non-driver EMT position somewhere, relocate, and then start school there for fire.

It's either that, or stick it out here for a bit and volunteer as an EMT to gain some experience. Attend fire school in May, and then once I get certified in that, I should be close to being clear with my driving record.

I'm just a little lost and need some direction, truthfully.

Here's what it boils down to:

-I'd love to live in Colorado if possible, but only if I was able to get a non-driver EMT position somewhere (prior to moving of course).

-I want to attend fire school. That's for sure.

-I wouldn't mind staying in Florida, but again, only if I could find a non-driver EMT position. And from what I can see, it's extremely rare, especially considering we have so many EMTs in this state that have CLEAN records.

 

[akflightmedic]

So take a moment and be honest with us, so that others may learn and maybe do or not do the same things as you have.

Yes, that was me.

Essentially I want to be a firefighter. I believe I would enjoy medic, but I can't say for certain since I haven't worked as an EMT yet. And truthfully, I don't want to hold such a huge responsibility and be the one "in charge" right now (obviously).

If firefighting is your goal, then why did you go to EMT school first?
Did you do any career or job market research prior to going to school?
Did you enjoy EMT class and your clinicals; did it make you want more?

I DO want to relocate, but I only want to relocate so that I can start my medical career. I know it sounds silly to relocate across the country for a job that might only pay $10/hour, but sometimes, you have to start somewhere. I was hoping to land a non-driver EMT position somewhere, relocate, and then start school there for fire.

You do BUT only to start a career which you are not sure you want to do anyways but basically HAVE to do to be a firefighter just about anywhere, so might as well. It is silly to relocate for a minimum wage job that exists in every single state, it is just a matter of obtaining it.

What makes you think your chances of getting hired in CO are any better than FL?
Do you think there are less EMT-Bs there?
You could relocate within FL and most likely find a job, plus it would be a lot cheaper and you would be in the state where you want to be a firefighter (I presume).

It's either that, or stick it out here for a bit and volunteer as an EMT to gain some experience. Attend fire school in May, and then once I get certified in that, I should be close to being clear with my driving record.

Now that sounds like a plan (shudder). Despite how I feel about volunteering and what it does to our profession, if that is your only option, then what are you waiting for? Go get your feet wet and get in fire school.

Have you contacted the fire schools to see if you will be allowed in with your record? That may be a factor in all your decisions as well.

Besides, if FL is ultimately where you wish to work, you do not need to be leaving the state and attending the fire academy else where as you will have very little chance at reciprocity. FL requires many more hours for FF training than most states and very rarely offers reciprocity.

I for example, was denied reciprocity for my fire certs and had to redo the FL FF academy when I relocated here from another state and I had many years experience under my belt. You will be attempting it with none.

-I'd love to live in Colorado if possible, but only if I was able to get a non-driver EMT position somewhere (prior to moving of course).

Again, do some research about your new chosen career. Non-Driving EMT positions are RARE. It is typically the EMT who is driving. Very few, if any will hire a basic that can only ride shotgun. It is cost prohibitive as a private employer and increases liability or may create a hairy situation in any kind of public service model.

-I want to attend fire school. That's for sure.

Well go do that, but where?

-I wouldn't mind staying in Florida, but again, only if I could find a non-driver EMT position. And from what I can see, it's extremely rare, especially considering we have so many EMTs in this state that have CLEAN records.

It is rare everywhere. Now where do you want to live? It seems to me you are going about it backwards.

 

[BossyCow]

Okay BossyCow, it is my area and the administration. (reference from another thread)

I think Sasha has just covered many of the problems faced in Florida and other Fire based EMS regions.

Why are there 'non fire medics' in a fire department? That makes no sense at all. Here, a medic in a fire department is fully trained as a firefighter to the same standard as every other firefighter. Those standards are set by the administration of the agency. The OP is from your area, as is Sasha.. so to me.. since this is not an issue in the Northwest, tells me that it is a regional one.

 

[VentMedic]

Why are there 'non fire medics' in a fire department? That makes no sense at all. Here, a medic in a fire department is fully trained as a firefighter to the same standard as every other firefighter. Those standards are set by the administration of the agency. The OP is from your area, as is Sasha.. so to me.. since this is not an issue in the Northwest, tells me that it is a regional one.

There has never been any secret about Florida or California by the numerous threads about them.

Mostly it was a goodwill gesture to keep some non fire medics. So many really good Paramedics who have no interest in being FFs have lost their jobs when the areas covered by the private or county EMS companies they worked for were taken over by fire. This has included many who have been Paramedics for 20+ years and are well over the age of 40. A lot of EMS dedicated and experienced people have been lost to jobs other than EMT or Paramedic. This has happened in almost every region of the state. Unless you are a certified FF in Florida with a job at a FD, you may have no future in EMS or at least not for very long. Even the stronger County EMS systems must fight to remain separate. We recently had one of our better county EMS systems merge with Fire and go under the Sheriff's office for adminstration.

Rural Metro in the Orlando area, EMSA in Marion County, Collier county, Hillsborough county and Broward County are just a few. Polk County EMS will be next.
http://www.newschief.com/article/20...itle=Polk_merger_plan_for_EMS__fire_draws_ire

Palm Beach Fire Rescue is the result of at least 16 different mergers.

Miami-Dade Fire Rescue is also the result of most of the EMS and Fire services in Dade County.

Besides Florida and California, there are similar issues in Pennsylvannia, Maryland, Ohio, Illinois, Michigan, and Washington D.C to name a few. FDs all over the country are again starting their own back room classrooms, bypassing the colleges, to make every FF a Paramedic. Memphis, TN and Kern County,CA are just a few of the FDs to announce doing their own training to get more Paramedics on the streets faster.

So no, this is not just my area, but it is a national issue as well. Just doing a quick glance at Washington state, it too has not been immune to many different mergers with fire and EMS.

 

[Desert Ranger]

Some of us have gone to FLETC and are law enforcement, and are EMT's, as well as structural and wildland firefighters. So which are we? And does it matter as long as we are trained...

 

[BossyCow]

Some of us have gone to FLETC and are law enforcement, and are EMT's, as well as structural and wildland firefighters. So which are we? And does it matter as long as we are trained...

That's exactly my point. Does it matter who runs the agency if the agency is run to a high standard. I see the combination of resources and infrastructure as a good thing. But, if its done with only a sideways nod towards maintaining either skills in fire or EMS then the issue is not fire vs EMS but in maintaining standards in skills.

 

[VentMedic]

Some of us have gone to FLETC and are law enforcement, and are EMT's, structural and wildland firefighters. So which are we? And does it matter as long as we are trained...

That's exactly my point. Does it matter who runs the agency if the agency is run to a high standard. I see the combination of resources and infrastructure as a good thing. But, if its done with only a sideways nod towards maintaining either skills in fire or EMS then the issue is not fire vs EMS but in maintaining standards in skills.

Medical professionals should be educated and not just trained. There lies the problem that exists in EMS today.

Too many are "Jack of all trades and master of none". To continue to view EMS as a trade school cert and not a profession does little to promote change for improvement.

 

[Desert Ranger]

Medical professionals should be educated and not just trained. There lies the problem that exists in EMS today.

Too many are "Jack of all trades and master of none". To continue to view EMS as a trade school cert and not a profession does little to promote change for improvement.

So are you saying that EMT B training is worthless and the park visitors that are my patients should fear for their lives since I only have training? BTW, been a "trained" EMT for 17 years.

 

[BossyCow]

Medical professionals should be educated and not just trained. There lies the problem that exists in EMS today.

Too many are "Jack of all trades and master of none". To continue to view EMS as a trade school cert and not a profession does little to promote change for improvement.

I don't see how this relates to fire.. it relates completely to the level or standard being set by the agency. High standards set by your employer will require meeting those standards to be hired and kept employed. Drop those standards and your applicants will sink to the lowest amount of effort required to get and keep the job. Not just EMS, but human nature.

 

[VentMedic]

So are you saying that EMT B training is worthless and the park visitors that are my patients should fear for their lives since I only have training? BTW, been a "trained" EMT for 17 years.

The discussion had been about Fire Medics. EMT-B is a useful first aid class which should be promoted for those who count as first responders. This includes the industrial setting where may companies do put their employees through similar training even if they aren't called "EMTs". But, an EMT and a Paramedic are not the same any more than a CNA and RN are. If one wants to acheive professional status and repect, the appropriate level of education should accompany the skills.

 

[VentMedic]

I don't see how this relates to fire.. it relates completely to the level or standard being set by the agency. High standards set by your employer will require meeting those standards to be hired and kept employed. Drop those standards and your applicants will sink to the lowest amount of effort required to get and keep the job. Not just EMS, but human nature.

Why should one be forced to do two totally different jobs? If one wants to be a FF, why should they be a Paramedic?

If one wants to be a Paramedic, why should they be forced to be a FF?

If one wants to be an RN, should they be forced to become a construction worker also to help build the new hospital wing?

 

[Desert Ranger]

The discussion had been about Fire Medics. EMT-B is a useful first aid class which should be promoted for those who count as first responders. This includes the industrial setting where may companies do put their employees through similar training even if they aren't called "EMTs". But, an EMT and a Paramedic are not the same any more than a CNA and RN are. If one wants to acheive professional status and repect, the appropriate level of education should accompany the skills.

Jeez, seems as though my yearly LE refresher, bi-annual EMT refresher and monthly LE, fire and EMS training is just not enough to keep people safe or care for patients, not to mention my 17 years of experience. Guess I am in the wrong field. These four skill sets are required of a park ranger to maintain employment. Parks aren't cities where the hospital is minutes away. Minimum ground transport is more than an hour. Flight is 1.5 hours minimum.

 

[VentMedic]

Jeez, seems as though my yearly LE refresher, bi-annual EMT refresher and monthly LE, fire and EMS training is just not enough to keep people safe or care for patients, not to mention my 17 years of experience. Guess I am in the wrong field.

I seriously hope you are not complaining about ALL those hours it takes to become an EMT or the CEUs to recertify. If you are, then yes you are in the wrong field. EMT is at entry level status. But you have made my point clearly. Imagine if you were a Paramedic or an RN trying to juggle all those titles and responsibilities.