Self Defence in EMS

WannaBEMT

WannaBEMT

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I was wondering if anyone could point me to a place I could get some information on Self Defence Tactics for Medics. I just passed the NR on Dec 15th and going for my mock clinical code at the largest level one trauma in the state. I am very worried about this subject as this is where I have my heart set on working at. My teacher, who is the recruitment person at this hospital asked me to come down and do this, as you have to pass there "NR" for lack of a better name.

I want to be taught how to defend myself, on my ride time there I saw some freaky stuff and I want to make sure I am prepared. I would feel more safe having a male partner but that is just me. Can anyone provide any tips or any qood links on this topic....

Thanks so much,
Jenn
 
Definanlty check that site out. He has invaluable information available!!(though I bet Kip has a value put on it ;) like $29.99 + s/h?? :P :P )
 
do what i did. pack on the muscle and get a black belt.....well i got that years ago but man what a help if i ever needed it. but in a dangerous situation i would just radio for police. if the police arent there (which is never) i grab the portable b4 getting out of the truck.
 
Mercy-

Your black belt will come in handy for those unexpected dangerous situations. Obvious dangerous, or potentially dangerous scenes, law enforcement is a given. You need to be aware of those that aren't so obvious.

My partner and I responded to the 6th floor of some condos in our district for a fall. The 6th floor is 1 condo. Custom italian marble everywhere. Its a multimillion dollar Condo. We get there and there was a 59 yo M on the ground, bleeding from the nose. He'd had some wine, slipped and fell, busting his nose. Pt c/o neck pain as well.

As we loaded him onto the stretcher, he began yelling. When we got into the hallway, he grabbed hold of my partner, began cussing both of us "b*thces." He then began spitting blood at her while twising her down to her knees. End result was me using the stretcher for leverage as I came down on his already broken nose with my fist and her finger was broken.

My next question would be, do you only have a portable on those potentially dangerous calls? Maybe its just me, but I consider even the most innocuous sounding calls as having the potential to turn south. Because I always have my radio, I was able to call dispatch and have law enforcement on scene with this guy before we got down in the elevator with him.
 
Thanks you guys so much for the info, I am going to go check out that link, price sounds worth it to give myself a bit of knowledge...

Jenn
 
Hello Jenn,

Well, we took our DVD off of the market. The only way to get one now is to attend one of our courses. There were too many people purchasing it and teaching some of my stuff and never giving credit (you know claiming they created it).

I found EMS instructors and Karate schools were the ones purchasing it. Another reason we took it off was because I didn't want people thinking we were just trying to "make a buck" off of EMS. In almost 11 years of teachign DT4EMS it has mainly cost me.

I feel if we do it for the right reasons it will eventually pay off.

We offer tons of "free" stuff in the form of videos and PDF's with step by step pics on the www.dt4ems.net website.

I encourage you to do a ton of research on the subject. Any training is better than none. Just beware you MUST have a good understaning of your local laws.

Self-Defense for EMS is truly unique. It should be something you consider for your personal safety as much as putting on your gloves.
 
well i only take the portable when there is no police on scene. Otherwise the police are in the room with us controlling the scene and if anything went down they are right there.
 
Mercy4Angels said:
well i only take the portable when there is no police on scene. Otherwise the police are in the room with us controlling the scene and if anything went down they are right there.
Click to expand...

We train EMS to always have their portable and or cell phone at all times. If you train the "habit" you will always have it with you. There may be a time you have to run, hide etc. Having communication ability will be a huge asset the time you do need it. :)
 
Good point about the radio Kip. I almost feel naked without it.


Mercy4Angels said:
well i only take the portable when there is no police on scene. Otherwise the police are in the room with us controlling the scene and if anything went down they are right there.
Click to expand...


Do you have law enforcement on every single call you go on? That would be a huge assest, but is not resonable in my area.

We have PD or SO dispatched with us or arrive before us only on certain types of calls. But in a typical shift my truck runs as many as 20 calls and we might only have law enforcement on 5 or 6 unless we call them.

There are some shifts that we don't have law enforcement on ANY of our calls, because they are the types of calls they automatically go to.
 
Dont' forget a lot of EMS assault reports took place on "Safe Scenes".
 
DT4EMS said:
Dont' forget a lot of EMS assault reports took place on "Safe Scenes".
Click to expand...

As was the case in the fall patient I described above.

Would you agree DT that once we have decided the scene is "safe" a lot of times as providers we may let our guards down to some degree, and that is what allows the assaults to take place?
 
EMTPrincess said:
As was the case in the fall patient I described above.

Would you agree DT that once we have decided the scene is "safe" a lot of times as providers we may let our guards down to some degree, and that is what allows the assaults to take place?
Click to expand...

Yes.

That is probably the biggest problem. That and the "attitude" of the provider. Too much "machismo" gets people assaulted. When training officers I used to tell them poking somone with your finger is a free shot to your face!

In the study done in '05 that revealed 52% of all EMS injuries were due to assault, only 21% of providers felt their personal safety was an issue. I found that disturbing.
 
I agree 100% with Princess. While PD are always dispatched to ANY of our calls (and sometimes even show up at the 911 calls to the nursing homes :)) an EMS call ranks below some other PD calls.

I carry a radio EVERY time I get off the ambulance on a call.
I've been burned ONCE where I had to call 911 to get PD out because my "laceration" was after the wife threw a glass punchbowl at the husband and the domestic isn't quite over.
I've been on more than one "stupid drunk" call that turned into an ALS-level OD or assault where I needed medics. Why should my partner or I have to leave the patient to call for ALS?
Occasionaly, we have to "look around" for our patient for any number of reasons (Pt. fled after family said they were calling 911, Pt. is an intoxicated subject and is "passed out in back of XXX Main St.) and we occasionally split up. I try to make sure that I am nearby a LEO or another member of my crew, but that dosen't always happen. The radio is a little extra "piece of mind"

There are MANY reasons to carry a portable ALL the time. Like Princess, I feel naked without it (part of that is that I work Security 40+ hours a week and ALWAYS have a radio). On another note, just because I have a portable dosen't mean I talk on it. It is a rare event that I use the portalbe for something, because we don't usually need to say ANYTHING on the radio - I LOVE MDT's!
 
Damn Glad i completed my black belt a few years ago. Although I did ask my instructor about maceing violent EDPs a while back and he seemed rather discusted at the idea.

Frankly i thought it was a pretty good one.
 
I generally believe that a simple workshop in self defense or a dvd by itself won't help much. Self defense needs to be drilled into ones's system. I am big into training in martial arts with live training a.k.a sparring on a regular basis. When one in trained in an "alive" art it is much easier to go into a workshop and pick something up . Its also easier to deal with violent people.
 
firecoins said:
I generally believe that a simple workshop in self defense or a dvd by itself won't help much. Self defense needs to be drilled into ones's system. I am big into training in martial arts with live training a.k.a sparring on a regular basis. When one in trained in an "alive" art it is much easier to go into a workshop and pick something up . Its also easier to deal with violent people.
Click to expand...

You are exactly right.

You must practice, regardless of what you train in. I practice an extremely live art. We take stick fighting, ground fighting and kickboxing and tie it all together.

Since I don't train for sport, it allows me to free my mind during the conflict (sparring). We are cautious to not get into the "sparring mentality" you know.... jab cross, okay... now it is your turn to jab cross etc........

We work the mind...... so "if" you are on the losing end and fear for your life........ we train under stress to retrieve our tool, more specifically our knife.

I am a firm believer people must train on a regular basis. I disagree that 16 hours can't give people a great base. Rememer we are talkig about the "average provider" not the skilled martial artist or boxer that is at the station.

How many "skilled" practitioners or even regular gym rats do you know in EMS?

If you can teach people how to train they are more likely to do so.
 
I wanted to add another point......

In most martial arts, or MMA you are having to train much more than self-defense. Self-defense can be very easy, it is fighting that is hard. Remember you don't get boo'ed or warned by the ref for backing up.

See if your mindest is avoidance, then escape the trainig is very easy. Remember DT4EMS is for the "average provider".

But for the most part Firecoins you are right (when it comes to most systems :) ). Just like you we found you must:
1) train in a "live" art (where you actually get hit)
2) learn ground skills ( learning to escape) keep in mind how it may "appear to the media" if a medic grounds and pounds someone.

Look what just happened in Portland. That video made the FF look like the attackers.

Another point on Survivial Mindset........ did you see the article on Sherdog about the pro MMA fighter that resorted to BITING a guy during a fight? His response to the stress of fighting "on a futon" was to bite.

I for one am glad you train! Keep it up and try to motivate others you work with .
 
I see nothing wrong in training for sport. Yes I know the differences between sport and the street but for many martial artists, this becomes an excuse for training that is not alive. Their techniques are too "deadly" for the ring so they don't do alive training.

That being said, your right DT. Ground & Pound strategies of MMA are inappropriate for EMS. So is choking someone out or breaking a limb as submission grappling tends to do. I guess that would be where the workshop would come in handy.
 
:ph34r:

As an Honest answer, yes I have been training for many years, and yes I do believe training from a DVD will only give you a false sense of confidence that in a live combat scenario will only get you hurt.

If you really wish to defend your self effectively, these techniques need to be drilled in to your head and tested by someone knowledgeable in the matter. Now as a Martial artist, and as an instructor, I tell my students, and I don’t feel I am misleading them in any way, that they need to practice any technique in the dojo a thousand times before they will feel confident executing one in live combat.

Now for someone who does not want to be a "full fledged Martial Artist" but would like to know how to defend him or herself, there are only very few credible options that I am aware of unfortunately. The idea needs to be similar to the Israeli combat tactics taught to their army (Krag Mada SP?). This is not so much a martial art but a simple close range unarmed combat program designed to be taught to stupid people quickly. The problem for EMS is that it is some what blatantly lethal in its design. (This of course will cause more man hours and even worse - PAPER WORK!!!)

I am not familiar personally with the DT4EMS program and its curriculum. But from my limited understanding, this instructor seems to have paid his dues in EMS and has an idea of what works and what doesn’t. I like the direction he is going with this idea, but the execution of getting it off the ground is key. Honestly I am not familiar enough to offer my opinion on the techniques and philosophies. However I do strongly believe if the program chooses a path where other competent martial artists are taught the curriculum and go to their home cities to spread this knowledge, as apposed to just shipping off DVD’s to every one, it will have a much more effective impact on the EMS community. At the end of the day we are one big family and no body wants to send another family member in to the wolves unprepared right?

Especially not for a quick profit.

I am personally looking forward to learning more about this program and I will definitely be posting again about my opinions. I have a few opinions myself about good techniques to escape violent EDP’s and none of them involve kicking and punching anybody. However I’m still working on my clinicals so again, there will be a future post stating either I have a good idea or I got my *** kicked by a cracked out junkie. (When that happens, mind you, I will shut up.)

Anyways, I look forward to anyone’s feed back.

Later
Christian.
 
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