School Nurse Wanna Be's

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Cup of Joe

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Ok, Let me throw this question in the discussion:

What would a school nurse have access to that a Paramedic would not be trained in or not be able to use? Schools have budgets, and I doubt that a school would have enough money to pay for a nurse and all the equipment that nurse wants.

My grammar school had an RN nurse with a first aid kit, some OTC medications (i.e. acetaminophen, benedryl, etc.), a scale, and an exam table.

In high school, they had the same thing, but no nurse. They trusted us enough to put on our own band-aids. Had a headache, here's two tylenol. If the child needed to go home, the parents were called to take the child to their primary care physician. If the child needed medical attention urgently, they called an ambulance.

If I was a parent or school administrator, I would have no problem with a paramedic in that role.

Also, what about colleges that have their own student run EMS organizations. Those are EMT-Bs who will most likely encounter more than a school nurse would (drunks, sports injuries, possibly drug overdoses).
 

JPINFV

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You know, we haven't even established the scope of practice for the school nurse yet. Here it is for California. It should also be noted that your average plain Jane RN isn't qualified to be a school nurse in California either.

School nurses may perform, if authorized by the local governing board, the following services:

(a) Conduct immunization programs pursuant to Section 49403 and assure that every pupil's immunization status is in compliance with the law, including parental or guardian consent, and good health practice.

(b) Assess and evaluate the health and developmental status of pupils to identify specific physical disorders and other factors relating to the learning process, communicate with the primary care provider, and contribute significant information in order to modify the pupils' educational plans.

(c) Interpret the health and developmental assessment to parents, teachers, administrators, and other professionals directly concerned with the pupil.

(d) Design and implement a health maintenance plan to meet the individual health needs of the students, incorporating plans directed by a physician.

(e) Refer the pupil and his or her parent or guardian to appropriate community resources for necessary services.

(f) Maintain communication with parents and all involved community practitioners and agencies to promote needed treatment and secure reports of findings pertinent to educational planning.

(g) Interpret medical and nursing findings appropriate to the student's individual educational plan and make recommendations to professional personnel directly involved.

(h) Consult with, conduct in-service training to, and serve as a resource person to teachers and administrators, and act as a participant in implementing any section or sections of a comprehensive health instruction curriculum for students by providing current scientific information regarding nutrition, preventive dentistry, mental health, genetics, prevention of communicable diseases, self-health care, consumer education, and other areas of health.

(i) Counsel pupils and parents by: (1) Assisting children and youth, parents, and school personnel in identifying and utilizing appropriate and mutually acceptable private and community health delivery services for professional care and remediation of defects. (2) Counseling with parents, pupils and school staff regarding health-related attendance problems. (3) Helping parents, school personnel and pupils understand and adjust to physical, mental and social limitations. (4) Exploring with families and pupils, attitudes, information and values which affect their health behavior. (j) Assist parents and pupils to solve financial, transportation and other barriers to needed health services. The holder of a services credential with a specialization in health for a school nurse who also completes the requirements for a special class authorization in health in a program that is approved by the commission is authorized to teach classes on health in a preschool, kindergarten, grades 1 to 12, inclusive, and classes organized primarily for adults.
http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=edc&group=49001-50000&file=49422-49427


...and the education requirement

44877. The qualifications for a nurse shall be a valid certificate of registration issued by the Board of Nurse Examiners of the State of California or the California Board of Nursing Education and Nurse Registration and a health and development credential, a standard designated services credential with a specialization in health, or a services credential with a specialization in health. The services credential with a specialization in health authorizing service as a school nurse shall not authorize teaching services unless the holder also completes the requirements for a special class authorization in health in a program that is approved by the commission. On and after January 1, 1981, the qualifications for a nurse shall also include proof satisfactory to the school district that the nurse has acquired training in child abuse and neglect detection. This requirement may be satisfied through participation by the nurse in continuing education activities relating to child abuse and neglect detection and treatment.
http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=edc&group=44001-45000&file=44830-44929
 
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Shishkabob

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The first link is to show that Nurses must go through a certification to become a School Nurse to further their education. Now, when going to school to get certified, it clearly states the program is intended for BSN nurses only. So if you must have the certificate, and you must have a BSN to do the program and get a certificate, you must be a BSN to be a School Nurse.
http://wvasn.com/certification.cfm
http://www.ab.edu/academics/nursing

And yet, no mention of it being a "law" as you claimed.
 
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Katy

Katy

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You know, we haven't even established the scope of practice for the school nurse yet. Here it is for California. It should also be noted that your average plain Jane RN isn't qualified to be a school nurse in California either.

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=edc&group=49001-50000&file=49422-49427


...and the education requirement

http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/cgi-bin/displaycode?section=edc&group=44001-45000&file=44830-44929
Agreed, in WV, you must be certified as well, and hold a BSN. The certificate holds educational training and medical training specialized in School Nursing, making it a specialty like any other.
 
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Katy

Katy

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And yet, no mention of it being a "law" as you claimed.
It says, and I quote, "The West Virginia Board of Education requires all nurses to become certified." And, in every school there, the certificate is only offered in the BSN program or a bridge program to the Bachelor's level, so yes, you have to be a Bachelor's Nurse.
 

JPINFV

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So, remind me, how much education and experience does the average paramedic have in developing, implementing, and monitoring individual health maintenance and providing assistance with education plans due to health issues?

How much education do paramedics have in dental hygiene?

How about subsection (i)?
 

JPINFV

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Agreed, in WV, you must be certified as well, and hold a BSN. The certificate holds educational training and nurse training specialized in School Nursing, making it a specialty like any other.


Fixed that for you. Nurses aren't educated in medicine.
 

Shishkabob

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It says, and I quote, "The West Virginia Board of Education requires all nurses to become certified." And, in every school there, the certificate is only offered in the BSN program or a bridge program to the Bachelor's level, so yes, you have to be a Bachelor's Nurse.

Requirement for a private educational program =/= state law.
 
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Katy

Katy

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Fixed that for you. Nurses aren't educated in medicine.
Thanks, I know they aren't, we all make mistakes.
Also, would someone like to point out how much education Paramedics get in Nutrition ? A huge part of School Nurses.
 
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Katy

Katy

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Requirement for a private educational program =/= state law.
Those are the only ones that give the certificate, they all require and even Fairmont states " The program is designed for BSN students ". There isn't any way around it, sorry, but thats how it is. An ADN can't be a School Nurse in my state.
 

Shishkabob

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Those are the only ones that give the certificate, they all require and even Fairmont states " The program is designed for BSN students ". There isn't any way around it, sorry, but thats how it is. An ADN can't be a School Nurse in my state.

And I go back, for the 3rd time: There is no state law, that you've provided, that says you have to hold a BSN.



Say you want an MBA for a job the state states you need an MBA in. The school may require you to hold a bachelors in business to do their program, but there is no state law requiring you to hold a BB to do MBA school.
 

fast65

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Thanks, I know they aren't, we all make mistakes.
Also, would someone like to point out how much education Paramedics get in Nutrition ? A huge part of School Nurses.

I got 3 credits of it, maybe not a lot, but still, a decent amount
 
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Katy

Katy

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And I go back, for the 3rd time: There is no state law, that you've provided, that says you have to hold a BSN.



Say you want an MBA for a job the state states you need an MBA in. The school may require you to hold a bachelors in business to do their program, but there is no state law requiring you to hold a BB to do MBA school.

You have to hold a BSN before you can get a certificate. If you can't get a certificate, you can't be a school nurse. Put two and two together, I'm sure there is a law.
 

Shishkabob

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You have to hold a BSN before you can get a certificate. If you can't get a certificate, you can't be a school nurse. Put two and two together, I'm sure there is a law.

I asked for the law. You haven't provided the law. 'Put two and two together.' Just because a private institution requires something doesn't mean it's law.
 

ffemt8978

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You have to hold a BSN before you can get a certificate. If you can't get a certificate, you can't be a school nurse. Put two and two together, I'm sure there is a law.
That's the type of thinking that can get you into trouble. If you can't find the law, then it doesn't exist.
 

JPINFV

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So, no one wants to discuss the training that paramedics have in counseling students and staff about genetic disorders or contributing to individualized educational plans?
 

DESERTDOC

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So, remind me, how much education and experience does the average paramedic have in developing, implementing, and monitoring individual health maintenance and providing assistance with education plans due to health issues?

How much education do paramedics have in dental hygiene?

How about subsection (i)?

I do not speak for all Paramedics, but I will speak for my self.

I have extensive training and direct clinical practice.

Not all Paramedics are equal in training or experience.
 
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Katy

Katy

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That's the type of thinking that can get you into trouble. If you can't find the law, then it doesn't exist.
]
The law says that a School Nurse must have the certificate, and in order to get the certificate one must have a Bachelor's degree at the least. The Certification's site is below and says it in plain detail.
http://www.nbcsn.com/examdefault.htm
 

Shishkabob

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This
Not all Paramedics (or nurses) are equal in training or experience.


And this


Because fresh out of school your average ADN is proficient in those abilities, but your average APS is unable to obtain the same level of proficiency?
 

JPINFV

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Ok, how much does the average paramedic have in those things?

After all, I know a fair number of EMTs who can interpret 12 leads, so should EMTs be interpreting 12 leads?

(On a side note, legally speaking paramedics in California can't do 12 leads right now. It's actually kinda of funny).
 
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