Need a Medic's Assistance to critique a report

BDhooghe

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Hello all. I am not sure who will be able/willing to assist me. As an EMT-basic, I truly regret having to go through and critique the run report of one of my own. Especially one who works for the very agency that taught me so that I could get my licensure.

Almost two months ago (September 9, 2007), I was placed at a very tough crossroad. My mother went horse back riding and fell off of the horse that she had rented. She had 40 years of experience riding, and was attempting to help another rider when her horse reared up and off she went. A local agency was dispatched, and they took her to a trauma center where she passed away on September 11, 2007 (as if that day wasn't bad enough!). Her Neuro surgeon, upon informing me that I had "A very difficult decision to make," had stated that he may have been able to do surgery had the medic inserted the ET Tube properly, therefore, her brain would have received proper oxygenation. With that having been said, I waited a couple of weeks before I decided to contact an attorney to have things investigated, and he asked that I please critique the run report, but honestly, a basic critiquing the report of a medic???

Upon trying to read the chicken scratch on this Medic's run report, I had several questions, a few of which BBFDMedic28 and Aileana have assisted me. The issues that I am having with this run report are this:

1. There is an hour's worth of missing vitals. I am under assumption, that they should have still been checked and documented. (We were taught that if it isn't written, it didn't happen.) Am I wrong in assuming that the hour worth of vitals should have been documented???


2. There was almost an hour in between the first attempt to intubate after the last documented set of vitals and nothing is written in the report about why it took so long to attempt the intubation, much less is there any mention of an attempt at inserting an OPA.

3. I am curious as to why there was no attempt at an OPA nor even a trach (at the worst) after two unsuccessful attempts at intubation.

A comment was made that just because the GCS was less than 3, does not always indicate a need for intubation, yet our instructor put it like this to us "less than 8, intubate." Aside from that, there WAS air support available.

This Medic worked for the responding agency for only two weeks prior to my mother's accident. I don't want the state to revoke his license, that's not fair unless it is proven that he was grossly negligent, but at the same time, if there is a case here, the attorney can go after the agency's insurance. Please let me assure you that I am not a "sue happy" person. I wrestled with contacting an attorney at all, it sickens me to have the actions of one of my co-workers investigated.

Any how, if there is anyone who would be willing to assist, please send me a private message and I will send the links for the run report to you.

Thank you in advance!

Respectfully,
B. Dhooghe
 
I waited a couple of weeks before I decided to contact an attorney to have things investigated, and he asked that I please critique the run report, but honestly, a basic critiquing the report of a medic???

Upon trying to read the chicken scratch on this Medic's run report, I had several questions, a few of which BBFDMedic28 and Aileana have assisted me. The issues that I am having with this run report are this:

1. There is an hour's worth of missing vitals. I am under assumption, that they should have still been checked and documented. (We were taught that if it isn't written, it didn't happen.) Am I wrong in assuming that the hour worth of vitals should have been documented???


2. There was almost an hour in between the first attempt to intubate after the last documented set of vitals and nothing is written in the report about why it took so long to attempt the intubation, much less is there any mention of an attempt at inserting an OPA.

3. I am curious as to why there was no attempt at an OPA nor even a trach (at the worst) after two unsuccessful attempts at intubation.

A comment was made that just because the GCS was less than 3, does not always indicate a need for intubation, yet our instructor put it like this to us "less than 8, intubate." Aside from that, there WAS air support available.

This Medic worked for the responding agency for only two weeks prior to my mother's accident. I don't want the state to revoke his license, that's not fair unless it is proven that he was grossly negligent, but at the same time, if there is a case here, the attorney can go after the agency's insurance. Please let me assure you that I am not a "sue happy" person. I wrestled with contacting an attorney at all, it sickens me to have the actions of one of my co-workers investigated.

Any how, if there is anyone who would be willing to assist, please send me a private message and I will send the links for the run report to you.

Thank you in advance!

Respectfully,
B. Dhooghe


First thing, find another attorney! He should had NEVER have you critique any run report, that is if you want to win. That is HIS part to find an expert witness and technical expert to review medical records and obtain expert opinions. Yes, I have submitted many working as a consultant for different law firms, never ever allow the family to be as the "so called" witnesses as an expert reviewer; that is if you want to win.

It appears he does not either take your case seriously, or is too cheap to hire an expert in rebutal the EMS services attorneys will shred opinions.

Yes, there is apparent problems of the call, if you are stating the facts. If it was an esophageal intubation and was not noticed or documented as by confirmation of lung sounds, or EtCo2 was not used. Which I am confused by your posting that physician described the tube was in the esophagus and later you described that there was no tube placed? As well, wthout knowing the full extent of injuries, type of call (geography), etc. one can only make assumptions.

As well, your litigation and the medics license or certification are separate issues. One can be sued and still keep their license...look at physicians. If your attorney did not emphasize this, again, time to look for another one.

Another thing; don't get hung up on the OPA thing. One can find an expert to testify there worthless, or that the medics performed MJT, etc. Again, the one with the most toys or best testimony wins. Again, the reason one needs an expert reviewer and opinions. The reviewer needs to be abreast of the curriculum, protocols, and local community standards that the medic will be judged by.

Chances are they will settle. One thing, as honorable as this might be and I do agree that by your descriptions; actions should had been taken, be aware of the potential ramifications. Your EMS career could be short lived, no matter if it was right or wrong. Sorry, that is the real life. Right or wrong...

Good luck,

R/r 911
 
I agree with Rid about finding a new attorney. They should be doing their own investigation. A defense attorney would tear apart a family member's biased critique in no time. Not to mention that as an EMT, you are limited in your ability to be credible in a case like this. There's no offense intended in that.

I also question the one who comments on a GCS of less than three. Three is the minimum number that one can have for a GCS. And as well, like you mentioned, a GCS less than eight does not always equal intubation even though the saying says otherwise.

We would need many more details in order to accurately offer any assistance. But this kind of investigative work should be handled by your attorneys.

Shane
NREMT-P
 
The attorney is a family friend. He has been an attorney for the family for 30 years. He is unable to take the case to court due to the county that the lawsuit would be in, but has offered to see if we have a case.

He asked me to review the run report due to the fact that, I, as a basic knew that things (written in the report) didn't measure up when I read it. Along with the fact that there are certain things that we were taught in EMT-basic class that made me question the medic's report in the first place.

I am not worried about my EMS career, as the fire department that I work for stands behind me 100%, and when it comes down to it, as much as I love being an EMT, my true dream is to become a RN specializing in burns (which I am working towards)

No offense was taken to the comment about a basic reviewing a Medic's report. That is why I asked for help. I want to know if there is anything obvious that I am missing and/or have over looked. I believe that I have hit all of the points at which there are questions concerning the report, but now the attorney knows where my questions and concerns come into play and he can go from there. If there are other things that can be brought to his attention, he will have an easier time focusing on specific aspects rather than a generalized investigation, especially since he is doing this for free.
 
Which I am confused by your posting that physician described the tube was in the esophagus and later you described that there was no tube placed?


The physician never described where the tube was placed. And according to the run report, there was not a third attempt at placing the tube. The report states that there were two unsuccessfull attempts. Better yet, here are the links to the report...


http://s240.photobucket.com/albums/ff291/fire_fighting_dad/?action=view&current=runreport1.jpg

http://s240.photobucket.com/albums/ff291/fire_fighting_dad/?action=view&current=runreport2.jpg

http://s240.photobucket.com/albums/ff291/fire_fighting_dad/?action=view&current=runreport3.jpg

(Figured that there is no sense in leaving a relatively blank post...)
 
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Just a thought as to why it took so long to attempt to intubate her. Could it be that with a suspected head injury and such a long time with the patient, it took time for the injury to progress to the point of warranting intubation? I know I did a call last week where someone was assaulted about three or four hours before I got the call, and by the time I got there they were well into their CVA with an onset of symptoms presenting for only about 15 minutes or so? Sometimes it takes time for a patient to progress, especially with a head injury. With regard to the failed intubation, head injuries can be difficult to intubate, especially without RSI. Trismus is not uncommon, and the only way around that is paralytics. I can't really read the narrative, so I'm just throwing ideas out there. While on the surface, it may seem like the medic did a poor job it might be a poorly written run form that is the problem (not that it makes it excusable). I'm sure she was intubated at the ED, so I'd be curious to know what meds they used (if any) to facilitate the tube? If they used meds that aren't carried in your area prehospitally, that could well be the problem. Just some thoughts.

Shane
NREMT-P
 
What I can decipher from the posts, yes it is a poorly written report. Yes, we all make errors (definitely myself) so I am not promoting self righteousness. If nothing else, BDhooghe has made a valid point of the importance of legibility, and being in depth of documentation for all of us.

I question several areas. First, that her saturation percentage initially was described as 98% then deteriorated after intubation. As well, as you described no vital signs >1 hour.(they do have pulse with ECG interpret) Yes, they documented for the initial then ceased. An addendum should have been included.

Other areas I question is the use of Valium? Is this the choice for RSI or induction according to the protocols? If so, it might be acceptable (albeit outdated and should have been changed) why was it administered?

As well, no mention of lung sounds of verifying, NO EtCO2 device, was mentioned. Remember the ONLY LEGAL DOCUMENTATION OF A INTUBATION IS WAVE FORM EtCo2 showing proper placement. If you don't have one, then you are asking to be sued! Either get it or quit intubating patients... period!

If your patients saturation deteriorates, then document measures taken to correct and to SEE why it might be so. Again, verifying tube placement per auscultation, EtCo2, checking for pneumo etc, even Spo2 placement. Then document that you were aware, actions taken to attempt to correct it, and results.

If one was to base the knowledge of the medic in question, then I feel sorry for the services attorney. The service should have a QI program that reviewed this paperwork and requested an additional form and corrections. As well, not only is this paperwork sloppy, but does not "flow", in which courts and juries like. There is no mention of ECG interpretation, but pasted ECG rhythms?

Instead of drawing lines through additional assessment and documentation, the Paramedic should had documented.

The old saying.. If it was not documented, then it was not performed..... cannot be stressed enough.

I believe you have enough or poor documentation to cause questioning in care. Albeit, we do not have the "other side", and unfortunately the paperwork is the only voice the medic has after a call.

I know your purpose is not to "ruin: this medics career. Then again, maybe this medic is incompetent or is a danger to others in medical care. If one was to base their opinions upon documentation alone, this is something to be considered.

Good luck,

R/r 911
 
I completely agree that reading the report as posted does make things one sided. The biggest thing that bothers me the question of "What happened in the one hour in between the last set of documented vitals and arrival at the trauma center?" I have instructed the attorney to check on getting the tapes from dispatch AND the HERN tapes so that this question can hopefully be answered.

By looking at the run report, it seems that the QA may have had a bit of an issue with the use of valium to relax her as well, as that was circled when we picked the report up from the office. I'm not sure when it comes to the drugs of what can and can't be pushed, but something that was brought to my attention in the hospital was that my mother had a heart attack after the accident. I'm not sure if other meds carried may have been contradicted with that.

I want to take a moment to say thank you. If nothing else, this is good therapy for me, and I'm glad that the questioning of this can assist in leading others to the importance of proper documentation. It is truly something that can not be stressed enough.

**In response to Medic001918: The attorney is in the process of attempting to get all of the paperwork from the hospital so that it can be reviewed.**
 
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I do understand your dilemma. My mother died as a result of some medical negligence. Unfortunately, due to the physicians reputation and outstanding career, I knew my chances were slim and was advised as well by some excellent attorneys it would probably be futile.

I was however able to change and correct the way the care was delivered. The main point of my intention, to begin with.

I am sure your attorney will have multiple reviewers and "expert" witnesses. Again, if not then as I described, there are many "hungry" attorneys out there.

It is difficult to pursue litigation, especially being in the profession. You are not "picking" upon anyone, but maybe change within the system as well, Better QI and then yes, if the medic needs reprimanding or even removed from the system so be it. It is better than a repeated tragedy to re-occur again.

It appears there were many problems with this call. Many I did not even discuss due length of time in writing.

Again, best of luck.

R/r 911
 
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