CC or Paramedic

New York has a fifth and it is called the AEMT-Critical Care Technician. It is a watered down paramedic program.

Meant as Long Island medics, but quickly became the rural medic because the availability of the class was better, along with the fact that the state paid for volunteers to take it.
 
AEMT-CC was pretty much the worst idea ever, in terms of EMS training levels.

Most of us who frequent this forum agree that paramedic training should be longer and more rigorous.

Well, NYS thinks the opposite. They basically looked at the paramedic curriculum, chopped off 2/3rds of it, called it "critical care technician" (which shows you how little the folks who designed it actually know about critical care), and allow the course graduates to call themselves "critical care techs" and to practice under the same exact protocols as actual paramedics. (When I left NY 7 years ago, the only thing CC's couldn't do was RSI, which meant nothing because at that time few ground agencies were doing it anyway.)

Tl;dr: go to paramedic school, OP
 
The main difference remains what interventions can be done under standing orders, and what requires permission from medical control.

I have heard the 'almost a medic' argument for years. They are not, and I tend not to put NY paramedics on too high a pedestal either.
 
Scott33 said:
The main difference remains what interventions can be done under standing orders, and what requires permission from medical control.

I have heard the 'almost a medic' argument for years. They are not, and I tend not to put NY paramedics on too high a pedestal either.
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And what pretell does that mean? I can assure you the education I received in NY, and the care I provided while in NY is better than some states. For instance Massachusetts is far behind NY, which makes it decades behind the rest of the country. So please elaborate how NY medics are lower than other states. And if you use the term NY as the general term but are referring to the city, then you really need to broaden your horizons sir.
 
Scott33 said:
I tend not to put NY paramedics on too high a pedestal either.
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So every paramedic from NY is the same?

And do the paramedic programs there not adhere to the same national standards as most of the rest of the country?
 
Emt3752 said:
I would love to go back to school...do more for my pt's
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Sounds like you already provided a solid answer there.

From your post I get the feeling that if you just do the lower option you'll still want to eventually go back to school, so might as well knock it out now in one go around, save yourself some time and money to do what you want to do.
 
medic6676 said:
please elaborate how NY medics are lower than other states.
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Did I say that?

The educational standards of medics in the U.S. as a whole is sorely lacking. My experience is limited to NY however. You mention broadening horizons, so how does a GED medic compare to the likes of someone from Australia, NZ, Canada, SA, or the UK?
 
Scott33 said:
Did I say that?

The educational standards of medics in the U.S. as a whole is sorely lacking. My experience is limited to NY however. You mention broadening horizons, so how does a GED medic compare to the likes of someone from Australia, NZ, Canada, SA, or the UK?
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See here is the difference between the first thing you said and the second.

You started talking about NY medics only, and now say that you think the entire U.S. medic system is severely lacking. While I don't disagree that the U.S. has a long way to go before we are equivalent to the stellar level of EMS that countries, such as Australia, are at. You need to state that and not specify that you don't hold NYS medics on a pedestal, instead clarify that you think the entire system in this country is lacking.

Now here's what you need to know about the American EMS and Healthcare systems, and why we are behind a majority of countries, Th FDA makes it impossible to pass any new standards and research said standards. Other countries allow completely double blind medical research, whereas the U.S. as far as I know, is very strict in the areas of emergency care and blind research.

So until we can do optimal research and appropriately come to relatively conclusive answers about how to provide optimal care, we will be behind the rest of the world. Our education standards will continue to become better, as our evidence and research becomes better.
 
Scott33 said:
Did I say that?

The educational standards of medics in the U.S. as a whole is sorely lacking. My experience is limited to NY however. You mention broadening horizons, so how does a GED medic compare to the likes of someone from Australia, NZ, Canada, SA, or the UK?
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What is a GED medic?

And how do you quantify the comparison between a "GED medic" and one from those other places? Length of education? Clinical outcomes? Academic ability? Number of drugs or procedures they are allowed to use? Compensation?
 
medic6676 said:
See here is the difference between the first thing you said and the second.

You started talking about NY medics only, and now say that you think the entire U.S. medic system is severely lacking. While I don't disagree that the U.S. has a long way to go before we are equivalent to the stellar level of EMS that countries, such as Australia, are at. You need to state that and not specify that you don't hold NYS medics on a pedestal, instead clarify that you think the entire system in this country is lacking.

Now here's what you need to know about the American EMS and Healthcare systems, and why we are behind a majority of countries, Th FDA makes it impossible to pass any new standards and research said standards. Other countries allow completely double blind medical research, whereas the U.S. as far as I know, is very strict in the areas of emergency care and blind research.

So until we can do optimal research and appropriately come to relatively conclusive answers about how to provide optimal care, we will be behind the rest of the world. Our education standards will continue to become better, as our evidence and research becomes better.
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Your reply has nothing to do with EMS educational standards in the US vs other countries, most of which have requirenents of much more rigorous education for pre hospital care providers.
 
DEmedic said:
Your reply has nothing to do with EMS educational standards in the US vs other countries, most of which have requirenents of much more rigorous education for pre hospital care providers.
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Did you read my entire reply? I said the educational standards would follow the level of care provided. The education standards you are referring to are as high as they because they do a million more things than we do, including but not limited to blood transfusions.

The changes you are looking for won't happen in a volunteer culture either. Sadly in order for our career to move forward, and to excel to the equivalency of other nations, we need to actually decrease the volunteers, and not because they are bad for the standards, but they make it hard to further a career. As long as someone is doing it for free, we won't have value, and without value most people would rather move on in life than continue in this career. People who are in this service longer tend to help aid in the furthering of its expansion and growth.
 
I did read your entire reply and find it to be lacking. The educational standards follow the level of care? Nonsense.

And getting rid of volunteers has nothing to do with advancing the level of care.
 
So you're saying that the education standards won't increase if they are needed to through the increase of the level of care?

Because I believe that with new research comes new education...huh guess all those years in science class were wrong...dang maybe we should tell the entire science community that.

Education increases from research, but so does the level of care. Generally the level of care increases for the research to happen, and the education standards are increased across the board when the research is found valid. Oh wait that's the scientific method, guess all my years in science class actually paid off.
 
Also the volunteers are the reason the CCT program in NY still exists, because they can't afford paramedics, whether it be to put them through 8 grand of education or that paramedics feel that their education is more valuable at a paid job.

So yes they do have a DIRECT effect on the education standards in that aspect.
 
medic6676 said:
And what pretell does that mean? I can assure you the education I received in NY, and the care I provided while in NY is better than some states.
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medic6676 said:
In the instance of courses, I will admit I feel I took more, clinical wise, from my CC course than medic. In CC, I was required to attend ER time, Cath Lab time, L&D Time, and MedCon time, whereas with my medic class I was only required to do ER time, OR (tube) time(2 tubes) and MD shadow (one shift).
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Maybe it's just me, but when someone wants to brag about the quality of education in a given area but has to take two seperate courses to get the equivalent of a standard course elsewhere...something just doesn't add up...
 
triemal04 said:
Maybe it's just me, but when someone wants to brag about the quality of education in a given area but has to take two seperate courses to get the equivalent of a standard course elsewhere...something just doesn't add up...
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Are you implying something about me? Because if so ask what it is you appear to be implying.

If you want to know I took two courses because I took the CC when I was living in one area, and when I moved to another, the areas services didn't honor it. So I made a deal with those areas to upgrade my card.

But please clarify if you are implying what it appears you are about me. Because I assure you, that I didn't take two courses because I educationally-speaking needed to. So please clarify whether you are attacking me, or the curriculum...
 
You? No, I'm not implying anything about YOU.

What I'm flat out saying is that it is strange that you would make the statement that paramedic education in NY is good, and even better than some other states, and yet you had to take both a CC class AND a paramedic class to get the equivalent of a routine paramedic course in pretty much the rest of the country.

Let me make that even clearer. A paramedic course that has a clinical load that only includes time in the ER and one shift following a doctor is nothing to be proud of, and definetly not something that would make whichever state it was in stand out...at least not in a good way.
 
I stated that while it is not perfect, it is better than a few. I know this because I currently work in one of those states. And I actually was talking about the standards of care, not so much the education.

While the clinical standards were lacking, and by the way I should have explained the hospitals actually prevented my course from doing the time we were supposed to, our education was top notch, and I say this because the educators who taught me are all major players in the literature arena, and one of my educators has written numerous books and is a huge player in the NAEMT.

Every place has its faults, so if you want to question the standards of my system, then please question them. But do so professionally and without the condescending tone you have been using, as it does not show the professionalism that I have come to expect from my colleagues.
 
sounded like NYS. get your medic, it's much easier to get hired as a medic than a CC

And while it's true a CC can do almost as much as a paramedic (in an adult cardiac arrest anyway), a paramedic can do much more on pediatrics and perform more interventions on standing orders, without having to call medical control to get the doctor's permission.

I know quite a few competant CCs.... however, those who want to make it a career get their paramedic. Last I checked, there wasn't a simple CC to Paramedic transition course in NYC
 
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