I watched an assault and wondered

[MrRecovery]

1. Unconscious
2. Victim of a multiple person assault
3. Blood coming from a laceration in the head

In what instance would a person with basic first aid training move this person if EMS had not arrived.

I'm assuming that it would be common sense to assume they had spinal injuries or a concussion.

It was a weird situation. I was with my boyfriend walking our dog and I noticed a fight break in an alley behind a local bar. My boyfriend and I witnessed two people getting into a fight and soon enough multiple officers had broken up the fight. One of the characters was still being difficult and one of the officers used a electrical device on him.

I heard a weird clicking sound which make my puppy go crazy. The guy fell on his face and four cops swarmed him. They used metal sticks and were kicking him so hard I though the guy would die.

He went unconscious and I knew this because his screams stopped. Even then I watched one of them use his knee and hit him head. They used some type of strips on the around his ankles and used handcuffs behind his back. They left him facedown for a couple minutes and one of the officers pointed to a camera mounted on the side of the building and they dragged him bound to behind the building.

I could see his entire face was covered in blood as they dragged him by. My boyfriend asked for a card from one of the officers to say we witnessed the event and they "politely" told him to get lost.

I've taken a basic first aid course which was almost a decade ago, but from what I remember you would never move a person in a situation like this. How they handled him, and in the state he was in and moving him 40 feet seems almost criminal.

It's funny the EMS people arrived within minutes and used a stretcher for him and handled the guy like a baby. I can't help, but think I should lay a complaint or file a report.

Any thoughts?

 

[Shishkabob]

My first thought is calling shens.

My second thought is go about your own business and let the professionals do their job. Basic first aid doesn't really qualify you to do anything, let alone interrupt a police matter and move a supposedly unconscious subject without any equipment or any real knowledge in what you're doing, let alone the authority to do any of it in the first place.

 

[DrankTheKoolaid]

Lol sounds like the *** whippin they gave the guy was criminal and they wanted to not be under the cameras scrutinus eye any longer.

As for moving him the only time you would want to move a victim prior to EMS arrival is if the patient is in immediete danger such as fire, building collapse etc etc

 

[SoCal911]

I don't know why, but I just get this weird feeling that this story is either completely made up - or has been embellished quite a bit.

 

[Shishkabob]

I don't know why, but I just get this weird feeling that this story is either completely made up - or has been embellished.

Agreed, hence me calling shens.

But just to be safe, I also included "Stay away and let the professionals do their job" just incase...

 

[SoCal911]

Agreed, hence me calling shens.

But just to be safe, I also included "Stay away and let the professionals do their job" just incase...

My thoughts exactly... Even when working in EMS - we never interfere with Law Enforcement - let them do their job. Assuming you ARE telling the truth.. you don't know the whole story or the exact circumstances.

 

[the_negro_puppy]

 

[MrRecovery]

My first thought is calling shens.

My second thought is go about your own business and let the professionals do their job. Basic first aid doesn't really qualify you to do anything, let alone interrupt a police matter and move a supposedly unconscious subject without any equipment or any real knowledge in what you're doing, let alone the authority to do any of it in the first place.

My boyfriend and I didn't move him the police did. My goodness my boyfriend I are small and I would never move someone and I thought the police wouldn't have the proper training to do so.

My basic first aid note was only because what I'd seen online EMS are trained to deal with victims such as the one mentioned and the police typically only have basic first aid.

 

[MrRecovery]

Lol sounds like the *** whippin they gave the guy was criminal and they wanted to not be under the cameras scrutinus eye any longer.

As for moving him the only time you would want to move a victim prior to EMS arrival is if the patient is in immediete danger such as fire, building collapse etc etc

Thank you for the only response that answered my question. I am done here.

 

[Sasha]

Shenanigans.

 

[MS Medic]

I think this story registers on the same BS meter I refer to at the bottom of my post

 

[hippocratical]

If you play the video backwards, you'll see the officers are helping the suspect to his feet with their magic batons.

/misremembered Bill Hicks?

 

[MS Medic]

For the sake of argument, say that was an honestly sincere post. How do random people find sites like this and decide to ask those kinds of questions

 

[ffemt8978]

Thank you for the only response that answered my question. I am done here.

Most of the posts answered you question in some way...the only difference is they didn't give you the answer that you had already decided you wanted.

For future reference, before you go trolling an internet forum, you might want to spend 30 seconds on Google and determine what you are talking about first.

One of the characters was still being difficult and one of the officers used a electrical device on him.

Even in Canada, Tasers have been around long enough and in the news often enough for the vast majority of people to know what they are.

2. Victim of a multiple person assault
...
My boyfriend and I witnessed two people getting into a fight and soon enough multiple officers had broken up the fight

Two people fighting is NOT a "multiple person assault". If you are referring to the actions of the police, you seem to unable to grasp the concept that reasonable force by the police to affect an arrest is NOT assault. Granted, there are times where the police overstep their bounds, but you haven't provided any proof to that fact.

The guy fell on his face and four cops swarmed him. They used metal sticks and were kicking him so hard I though the guy would die.

How can they swarm him (which I'm assuming means basically dog piling him) and kick him at the same time? Knee strikes are a common tactic in PPCT, and so are diversionary strikes...both of which are acceptable if properly documented.

Even then I watched one of them use his knee and hit him head.

But you do not know if it was a strike or a compliance technique used to assist in controlling the subject while handcuffing.

I've taken a basic first aid course which was almost a decade ago, but from what I remember you would never move a person in a situation like this. How they handled him, and in the state he was in and moving him 40 feet seems almost criminal.

So you know for a fact that police are only trained in basic first aid, based upon what? There may have been justification for how they moved him, which you do not know about or are conveniently forgetting to mention. BTW, a person stopping screaming does NOT automatically equal unconsciousness...maybe he decided to cooperate. You do not know that. Your second sentence in this quote reveals your ulterior motive. You've tossed about words like "assault" and "criminal" and tried to infer that officers moved a subject simply because there was a camera present all based upon your decade old first aid class.

It's funny the EMS people arrived within minutes and used a stretcher for him and handled the guy like a baby.

That is the job of EMS, not the police department. Police are there to arrest and investigate, not coddle suspects who may be resisting arrest. What happened to the subject that complied with the officers? I'll go ahead and answer that for you. He was not tased, he was not beat with batons, he was not "kicked" and he was not dragged 40 feet.

I can't help, but think I should lay a complaint or file a report.

If you feel that way, go ahead. But what goes around can come around. I guess that's karma for ya.



** I am not trying to say the actions of the officers were justified or not justified. I am simply trying to point out that there are alternative explanations to what may or may not have happened.

 

[mycrofft]

Good for you remembering scene safety. Smart not to press an officer. Best to leave patient alone until EMS transports. FIle a complaint if you feel it is warranted, our opinions are irrelevant.

If this is in Syria, USSR, PR China or many other places, disregard the complaint thingee at the end....

 

[Handsome Robb]

If you resist arrest you are going to catch a woopin', simple as that.

The ticking noise you heard was more than likely a TASER by the way you described it. It's commonly used to detain unruly suspects, and is perfectly harmless if used correctly, which sounds like it was since you didn't say anything about hearing the noise over and over again in a relatively detailed post.

I think you saw something you didn't agree with and seem to be blaming the police department.

I treat every patient with the same amount of respect and kindness until they are a douche to me. Criminal or not they are going to get the same standard of care as little Timmy who fell and bonked his head.

Police work and EMS are totally different. They enforce laws and detain suspects, among other things. We take care of people after they pick a fight with police, viruses, bacteria, fungi or other inanimate objects.

Like Linuss said a first aid course 10 years ago doesn't give you're opinion much weight, no offense. I've watched people be detained by PD then provided care to them. More often than not we stop any bleeding, clean them up a bit then send them along on their merry way to jail with the arresting officer.

I'm wondering what a concussion has to do with moving a patient? Spinal injury, yes you are correct. Concussion, moving them wont make a difference unless you are banging their head along the ground while you move them and even then, depending on the severity, it may or may not make a difference.

 

[ffemt8978]

I highly doubt the OP will return simply because he stated he got the answer he wanted and was done here.

 

[AnthonyM83]

Wow, what defensive replies everyone is posting.

That situation is in no way surprising or unbelievable...not much in the post triggered a BS red flag. Also, if I were a regular citizen without working in the fields I have, I'd probably want to get a second opinion just like she did. Remember, she wasn't burning these guys at the stake...she just saw something traumatic and came to people who know more than her for an opinion. No need to burn our visitors to this site so early on.

To the original poster. Very very likely they have first aid training, but law enforcement duties usually go first before providing first aid. They control their scene suspects and manage their scene first. There was likely more to be done with that guy, like searching him for weapons first. First aid usually isn't high on their list, unless it's uncontrollable bleeding or the person stops breathing. You gotta realize, they're not healthcare personnel. They only take on a medical roll in most dire of circumstances (usually...there are many exceptions in some areas).

This is of course a general answer.

 

[SoCal911]

"They pointed to a camera and drug him off" - raises my bs flag... I could see them nod, or mention it to on another.. But it sounds to storybook to me.

 

[adamjh3]

If you play the video backwards, you'll see the officers are helping the suspect to his feet with their magic batons.

/misremembered Bill Hicks?