EMSA Driver Faces Homicide Charges in Fatal Crash

STXmedic

STXmedic

Forum Burnout
Premium Member
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83mph down the wrong way of an inner-city street?! That's ridiculous! My companies would hang us in a heartbeat for something like that! And his attorney said that was within procedure? Wow.
 
Epi-do

Epi-do

I see dead people
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I can't comment on whether or not all procedures were followed, since I do not know what the procedures for that service are. That being said, along with our policies for emergent driving, we are expected to drive with due regard. I can't fathom any situation in which driving 80+ mph in oncoming traffic lanes would be considered driving with due regard.
 
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Remeber343

Forum Lieutenant
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I would most definitely say he would be hung. That is no way to drive, even more so in the inner city. And going the wrong way. The whole thing is bad juju. I would like to see what procedure that is, it must be that one were we endanger the public for no good reason?

I think education is the key. And to make examples of people like that. There is no reason to be going that fast and under those circumstances. EVOC is important train IMO, and people that fail to drive competently while responding priority need to have a wake up call. I think that might be his. I wonder what part of that whole thing he thought was a good idea.
 
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WuLabsWuTecH

Forum Deputy Chief
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Wow, we're allowed about 20 when we've crossed the median! And that's the max!

Here in Ohio, the law is proceeding with due regard. Any court is going to find that 83 in the wrong direction is not proceeding with due regard. I have been north of 90 before, but it was in a controlled access freeway, middle of the day, clear conditions, and no traffic. All they have to prove to get you on that charge of "due regard" is to prove that what the other person was doing was reasonable in normal traffic, or as the circumstances would require. That is, if they were proceeding through a green light, that's normal. They may be cited for a failure to yield, but you'll be cited for the accident.
 
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Scott33

Forum Asst. Chief
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I have been trying hard to think of what type of call would require that type of response. Haven't been able to come up with anything yet.
 
JPINFV

JPINFV

Gadfly
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Nothing for the company to protect in California as the Vehicle Code 21056 specifically requires emergency vehicle operators to operate with "due regard for the safety of all persons using the highway." Highway is broadly defined by the California Vehicle Code as to mean any street, not just high capacity roads.
 
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Cawolf86

Forum Captain
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Wasn't there and with only having second or third hand information it is hard to judge - but the info reported so far makes it seem like yes, my agency would "hang" him.

My department uses Road Safety and follows it closely with bi-monthly reporting and accountability enforcement. Who knows how often he drove negligently without getting caught. "Black boxes" seem to be effective in controlling or training better driving habits. Nothing is perfect, but they help.
 
JPINFV

JPINFV

Gadfly
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Hockey said:
When unavoidable, an ambulance is to be driven no faster than 15 miles per hour in oncoming lanes. At the time of the accident, the ambulance was being driven to a priority two call, or one involving an emergency that is not life threatening.

Read more: http://newsok.com/emsa-driver-charged-in-fatal-crash-fired/article/3633571#ixzz1hsPDOiOb
Click to expand...


I'm generally against set speed limits. The speed should completely be determined by the traffic situation and nothing else. If I'm on a 6 lane road (3 in each direction), going up the number 1 lane against traffic, and I'm clear all the way up to the intersection where oncoming traffic is stopped at a red light, then inching along at 15 is absurd. 80 on a surface street is wrong regardless of the situation. Similarly, does the 15 mph apply if there is a middle lane that is used by both sides for turning (either by dashed yellow lines or switching off actual turn lanes as appropriate)?
 
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atropine

Forum Captain
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My department uses Road Safety and follows it closely with bi-monthly reporting and accountability enforcement. Who knows how often he drove negligently without getting caught. "Black boxes" seem to be effective in controlling or training better driving habits. Nothing is perfect, but they help.[/QUOTE]

Sounds good for your company, but what about EVOC, and other defensive driving certs, should those be a standard, I know where I work we don't even need that Ca ambulance cert, and we have ambulances, so should we standardized as an industry?
 
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JPINFV

JPINFV

Gadfly
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atropine said:
Sounds good for your company, but what about EVOC, and other defensive driving certs, should those be a standard, I know where I work we don't even need that Ca ambulance cert, and we have ambulances, so should we standardized as an industry?
Click to expand...

The California Ambulance Certification is more of a "do you understand the laws regarding driving an ambulance, including the CHP required equipment" and "do you have a background check" than an actual defensive driving course. It's not entirely worthless as operators should have a basic understanding of the vehicle codes specifically regarding an ambulance, but it by no means qualify someone for the psychomotor part of operating an ambulance.
 
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WuLabsWuTecH

Forum Deputy Chief
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JPINFV said:
I'm generally against set speed limits. The speed should completely be determined by the traffic situation and nothing else. If I'm on a 6 lane road (3 in each direction), going up the number 1 lane against traffic, and I'm clear all the way up to the intersection where oncoming traffic is stopped at a red light, then inching along at 15 is absurd. 80 on a surface street is wrong regardless of the situation. Similarly, does the 15 mph apply if there is a middle lane that is used by both sides for turning (either by dashed yellow lines or switching off actual turn lanes as appropriate)?
Click to expand...


I too am generally against set speed limits. There is an unofficial speed limit at the places I work, but it is up to the operator and the SOG's state so. The reason for this is that our chief doesn't want anyone getting hung out to dry if an investigation determines he was 2 mph over the SOG b/c now he wasn't following department policy. The policy is to drive with due regard and use speeds which are reasonable for the current conditions.
 
MMiz

MMiz

I put the M in EMTLife
Community Leader
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I've updated the thread title to make it more relevant and descriptive.
 
the_negro_puppy

the_negro_puppy

Forum Asst. Chief
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If the facts of the article are true, this mean should see a custodial sentence for driving dangerously and negligently and killing someone. These cowboys do not do EMS any favours
 
Tigger

Tigger

Dodges Pucks
Community Leader
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I'm trying to come up with a time that traveling 83mph in a metro area is a good idea. Or in any area for that matter, many ambulances are already pushing their chassis's capacity to the limit. A panic stop at 83mph may lead to some unintended consequences.
 
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shfd739

Forum Deputy Chief
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Wow.

Our policies would hang this person out to dry if he was one of ours. Our company max is 75 mph, on interstate, with perfect weather. The RSI boxes go nuts @77mph.

Our other policies are no more than 10mph over the posted limit (up to 75) and no more than 15mph over the prevailing traffic speed. Meaning if traffic is going 30mph, don't go over 45mph even if the limit is 55 in that area.

This was very preventable and unfortunate. Just a matter of time until the lawsuits are filed.


Sent from my electronic overbearing life controller
 
mycrofft

mycrofft

Still crazy but elsewhere
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NO safe way to drive that fast on a city street.

Stupid waste of equipment and life.
 
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