Time to defib

[daedalus]

This thread is to discuss news on the Michael Jackson case. I ask that we all place our opinions of him (good or bad) side so that we can learn from it.

I was watching CNN, and cannot find a link, but they are saying that the cardiologist at Jackson's house found him with "a weak pulse and no breathing" and that the cardiologist was unsure of the address to the house, so the time from discovering Jackson's condition to the initial 911 call was 30 minutes. LAFD was on scene in 10 minutes. This leaves a 40 minute gap with no ALS care.

Now, in my estimation, cardiac arrest would have ensued within 10 minutes of resp arrest, so being generous, there was 20-30 minutes without defibrillation and other ALS care. The chance for survival for a patient in arrest goes down 6-10% for every minute without defibrillation.

Thoughts? Sounds like a cluster f*** to me.

 

[Shishkabob]

Sounds like a stupid cardiologist to me.

 

[ResTech]

I been kinda following the latest developments too and the whole thing sounds kinda shady to me.

Thoughts? Sounds like a cluster fu** to me.

You better watch trying to circumvent the censor filter... the Community Leaders will slap ur fingers and issue you an infraction... I know because I got one

 

[daedalus]

I been kinda following the latest developments too and the whole thing sounds kinda shady to me.



You better watch trying to circumvent the censor filter... the Community Leaders will slap ur fingers and issue you an infraction... I know because I got one

I added those stars myself.

 

[MMiz]

Sounds like a stupid cardiologist to me.

From what is reported it appears as though he may not have been the most successful doctor. It reminds me of a cardiologist that is complacent and too far removed from clinical medicine.

 

[Scout]

Was he his own exclusive doctor. You cant really stay current and in practice if you only deal with 1 person

 

[daedalus]

Remember that even many cardiologists may not have done CPR since residency or med school, and even than maybe not unless they took call in the ER or signed up for an elective ER rotation. These guys are internal medicine doctors and have great minds but may not be able to act on a emergency alone in a non hospital.

 

[MMiz]

Was he his own exclusive doctor. You cant really stay current and in practice if you only deal with 1 person

Yes, he was on the production company's payroll for the upcoming MJ tour.

Additionally, the doctor went to a low tier medical school (Meharry Medical College), and from what I've read, didn't have a very successful medical practice.

 

[Shishkabob]

Remember that even many cardiologists may not have done CPR since residency or med school, and even than maybe not unless they took call in the ER or signed up for an elective ER rotation. These guys are internal medicine doctors and have great minds but may not be able to act on a emergency alone in a non hospital.

It doesn't take 8+ years of medical school to go "Oh crap, his pulse sucks, someone call 911"


It very well could have only been a respiratory arrest, but the doctors inaction led to a full blown CA which led to his eventual death.

 

[VentMedic]

On the CNN news they use the word "unconscious" when Paramedics arrived.

The doctor was not the one making the phone call to 911. He was in the background with Michael.

The house was recently rented and probably none of the people in it were from the immediate area.

The private physician does not carry around their own Emergency Room or even "whacker" kit. Some apparently watch too much TV like that hideous show about some fired doc acting like Macguyver.

The physician was also a friend so that may have been the capcity he was most comfortable acting as and possibly as a general consultant. Being on a company payroll might have just been a perk. Private physicians can fall into a gray area when they are out of their state and unsure of their full responsibility once an emergency occurs. It is even a gray area to have your patient end up at a hospital you don't have privileges at. Having your client die in your presence is not something any doctor looks forward to be it in a private home, office or even the hospital and especially if it is not expected.

Additionally, the doctor went to a low tier medical school (Meharry Medical College), and from what I've read, didn't have a very successful medical practice.

The doctor was also black and unfortunately even in the 1970s and early 80s black people were still discriminated against in medical schools. I know many of our doctors of all races but especially those that are black who have told some horror stories from that time.

How do you measure a successful practice. A medical practice is very expensive which is why we have several doctors closing their private practices to become hospitalists working just a 12 hour day 3x/week.

Some on this forum can barely sort out their own responsibilites for the role they play in EMS but believe they have all the answers for the death of a 50 y/o man with a complex medical history.

You better watch trying to circumvent the censor filter... the Community Leaders will slap ur fingers and issue you an infraction... I know because I got one

That's not even close to the video you posted.

 

[daedalus]

The private physician does not carry around their own Emergency Room or even "whacker" kit. Some apparently watch too much TV like that hideous show about some fired doc acting like Macguyver.

Royal Pains? Haha. We are having quite a discussion over at a PA forum I visit sometimes.

 

[FF-EMT Diver]

Sounds like a stupid cardiologist to me.

Thats why you dont hire a Cardiologist.....you hire a Paramedic with a whacker kit that could save the world.

Seriously I think we as Ems have far more open minds than some Dr's.

 

[bstone]

Remember that even many cardiologists may not have done CPR since residency or med school, and even than maybe not unless they took call in the ER or signed up for an elective ER rotation. These guys are internal medicine doctors and have great minds but may not be able to act on a emergency alone in a non hospital.

They have done an IM residency and a 3 year cardiology fellowship. But yeah possibly no CPR since residency.