More politics playing with people's lives.

CentralCalEMT

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http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-0607-compton-aed-20150707-story.html

Compton FD (an ALS transporting agency) had 17 out of their 74 firefighters have their EMS cert lapse. The local EMS agency pulled off all the AEDs on the engines and trucks meaning the only defib ability is on the ALS ambulances. Now I am no expert in math but it seems like 57 firefighters (over 75%) still have valid EMS certs. Maybe it is just me, but that does not seem to make any sense to me to pull off the AEDs. I find it highly unlikely that an engine is going to show up with no trained personnel.
 

DrankTheKoolaid

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There is much more to this story... Read the other articles about it
 

Aprz

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I just thought it was funny cause the owner of Explorer ambulance (or whichever company that was) was talking about how he work(ed) there, that a lot of his employees get hired there, and they only expect "the best of the best of the best, sir"! I also remember he was claiming to be a paramedic, but we couldn't find any record of him on www.centralregistry.ca.gov. Funny.


Politics is letting these guys continue to respond to EMS calls when they aren't a certified EMT and don't have recent CPR training. There are so many EMTs with CPR training that are dying for even a BLS IFT EMT job and these guys who are below standard are allowed to keep their job and continue responding to calls. Somebody said it before. You could throw a dead cat randomly in public and it'd probably hit 10 EMTs looking for a job. Unfortunately, you can throw a dead cat at this fire department and it would only hit up to 7 EMTs. Don't call 911... You'll receive care from the more highly trained public than this fire department, lol.

I guess they keep these guys for fire calls only.
 
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WolfmanHarris

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Sorry I don't blame politics here. Granted maintaining that level of restriction on AED usage (and the article seems to imply its AEDs not monitors being removed) is excessive when they're deregulated for the public, but if you want to provide medical care, then do it properly and take it seriously. The regulatory environment they're required to operate in wouldn't be a surprise for their management and shouldn't be a surprise for their crews. If providing emergency medical care was a priority for the department than this would not have been so widespread and more than one of the uncertified FF's would have recertified in the time they have had since the story broke in March. In four months they could have taken an entire EMT-B course from scratch.

The attitude that lead to this problem in the first place is best summed up in this quote:
"It doesn't put us in any danger," Thompson said. He noted that while Compton rescue units have long had defibrillators, state law does not require firefighters to carry them. "It's not a mandatory program. It's something that we would like to have."
 

CALEMT

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I just thought it was funny cause the owner of Explorer ambulance (or whichever company that was) was talking about how he work(ed) there, that a lot of his employees get hired there, and they only expect "the best of the best of the best, sir"! I also remember he was claiming to be a paramedic, but we couldn't find any record of him on www.centralregistry.ca.gov. Funny.


Politics is letting these guys continue to respond to EMS calls when they aren't a certified EMT and don't have recent CPR training. There are so many EMTs with CPR training that are dying for even a BLS IFT EMT job and these guys who are below standard are allowed to keep their job and continue responding to calls. Somebody said it before. You could throw a dead cat randomly in public and it'd probably hit 10 EMTs looking for a job. Unfortunately, you can throw a dead cat at this fire department and it would only hit up to 7 EMTs. Don't call 911... You'll receive care from the more highly trained public than this fire department, lol.

I guess they keep these guys for fire calls only.

But I am who I am. I have the best ambulance company that wakes up and craps excellence. While in another thread (100% directionless I think) someone stated it perfectly. Its a lack of leadership and command from superiors. It would be one thing for one or two people to miss a recent and not be current but when practically 1/4 of the department is lacking the necessary certs then its a failure of the higher ups. After all they don't pay training Capts. and Chiefs for nothing now do they.

Edit: I went back and it was Jim in the 100% directionless thread... gotta give credit where credit is due.
 
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CentralCalEMT

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I just thought it was funny cause the owner of Explorer ambulance (or whichever company that was) was talking about how he work(ed) there, that a lot of his employees get hired there, and they only expect "the best of the best of the best, sir"! I also remember he was claiming to be a paramedic, but we couldn't find any record of him on www.centralregistry.ca.gov. Funny.


Politics is letting these guys continue to respond to EMS calls when they aren't a certified EMT and don't have recent CPR training. There are so many EMTs with CPR training that are dying for even a BLS IFT EMT job and these guys who are below standard are allowed to keep their job and continue responding to calls. Somebody said it before. You could throw a dead cat randomly in public and it'd probably hit 10 EMTs looking for a job. Unfortunately, you can throw a dead cat at this fire department and it would only hit up to 7 EMTs. Don't call 911... You'll receive care from the more highly trained public than this fire department, lol.

I guess they keep these guys for fire calls only.


Notice that the department is still responding to EMS calls, they just do not have AEDs. If the EMS agency is so concerned, why do they let the department continue to respond to EMS calls in the first place without the proper equipment? That is what does not make sense to me and seems political. This is the same county that did not let private BLS ambulances responding to 911 calls carry AEDs for years because they were not the fire department. Are you saying that every person on a fire engine needs to have an EMT card for that unit to respond to an EMS call with an AED? Despite what most LA County agencies think, it does not take 4 EMTs and 2 Paramedics to be able to provide care. Where I work, with the outlying volunteer stations, most of the time only the captain or lieutenant has an EMT cert that the volunteers are first responder trained if that. It is not ideal, but we make it work. I completely agree that the lapse in certs of multiple employees definitely shows a breakdown in leadership, but the fact remains that there are still a lot of firefighters with valid EMT cards.
 

Aprz

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@CentralCalEMT That's what I said. The fire departmemt is saying "Oh, it is political that they are taking the defibrillators off the engine" and I am thinking "It is actually political to even let these fire fighters keep their job and continue to respond to EMS calls." I was pointing my finger at the fire department, but the EMS agency is also wrong to even allow this to continue.

I don't think it is necessarry for them to be EMT certified, but I do believe that is below standard. There are so many certified EMTs looking for jobs. EMT training is so short and little. I don't understand why these guys can't get their act together.

What made all of this very funny to me is somebody was posting on this forum earlier making this department and their private company sound like it had only "the best of the best of the best, sir!" The guy claimed to be a paramedic, but there was no record of him on centralregistry. Maybe he is one of the 1 of 4 that aren't certified, haha!
 

TransportJockey

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fatkid

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I just thought it was funny cause the owner of Explorer ambulance (or whichever company that was) was talking about how he work(ed) there, that a lot of his employees get hired there, and they only expect "the best of the best of the best, sir"! I also remember he was claiming to be a paramedic, but we couldn't find any record of him on www.centralregistry.ca.gov. Funny.


Politics is letting these guys continue to respond to EMS calls when they aren't a certified EMT and don't have recent CPR training. There are so many EMTs with CPR training that are dying for even a BLS IFT EMT job and these guys who are below standard are allowed to keep their job and continue responding to calls. Somebody said it before. You could throw a dead cat randomly in public and it'd probably hit 10 EMTs looking for a job. Unfortunately, you can throw a dead cat at this fire department and it would only hit up to 7 EMTs. Don't call 911... You'll receive care from the more highly trained public than this fire department, lol.

I guess they keep these guys for fire calls only.

The owner is a Paramedic, but he uses the alter ego of Sultain Muhammad. His name is Tim Lee. I know because I did a little research when I was thinking about applying there a couple months ago.
 

Clare

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I don't understand why you need a "certification" to use AED? If the lay public can use them with no medical training (which is, after all, what they were designed for!) then where is the logic?
 

triemal04

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I don't understand why you need a "certification" to use AED? If the lay public can use them with no medical training (which is, after all, what they were designed for!) then where is the logic?
Because those of us who are professionals are held to a higher standard than the lay public, even when performing the same task.

It's also possible that this is due to the simple fact that California is unable, in all regards, to govern itself and function as a coherent, reasonable state. A long time ago there was a seperate EMT-D designation in some states, including California. The "D" stood for defibrillation; since AED's didn't exist, some EMT's were taught how to identify a shockable/non-shockable rhythm in a cardiac arrest and use a defibrillator. Most states stopped using this quite some time ago, though there were some hold outs pretty recently; Cali was one I believe. It may be that the firefighters allowed this to lapse, and that Cali, in it's standard screwy way, still requires that addition to the normal EMT cert to use an AED.

Don't know, and in all honesty, given the location, don't care.
 

Tigger

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Apparently AEDs are not mandated on ambulances in CA either...
 

Uclabruin103

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Optional equipment my friends in Los Angeles. I know because I was a medic working down on one BLS car. Did my checkout, then went to my ops manager after not finding the aed. He informed me that this was an option they chose not to partake in.
 
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