FP-C vs CCP-C

[TransportJockey]

So I am about ready to take one of the certifying tests and was wondering on people's opinions about the two different ones. I am doing some ground CCT when I pull some shifts in the city, along with a year and a half as a lead medic I a very busy rural 911 system with two years as a lead intermediate before that. My goal is flight eventually, either fixed wing or rotor, but I don't know if having my FP-C prior to applying will hurt me or not. I've heard stories or it hurting and it helping.
Any ideas?

 

[STXmedic]

I've never heard of it hurting, but certainly heard of it being helpful. At the minimum, it shows that you're committed and showing a desire to further yourself and your education.

 

[shfd739]

A few flight medics I've talked to have said to just do FP-C. The clinical questions are the same and when you do apply it will put a you little ahead of the ones that don't have it.

If your area is like around here its competitive and any little advantage you can get will help.

 

[akflightmedic]

It is a requirement with most reputable flight companies.

FP-C and CCEMT-P

Get them both and maintain them if flight is your goal. It will make you eligible for most jobs which open and for those which do not require it, it will give you a competitive edge.

 

[WTEngel]

FP-C will generally get you on the short list automatically.

It by no means is a guarantee of a job, but having it will almost certainly guarantee a second look.

CCP-C and FP-C are basically equivalent. The clinical content is the same, except for some light flight physiology on the FP-C. The other main difference is that CAAMTS ground standards are tested on FP-C and ground standards are tested on CCP-C.

Those changes are pretty minor. If you can pass one exam, there is no reason you shouldn't be able to pass the other.

 

[TransportJockey]

Around here FP-C seems to be a requirement after a year I think... No requirement on hire (PHI, Tri-State Careflight, UNM Lifeguard, and Native Air are the local flight services to me). I'm trying to get into a CCEMT-P class, but it's rather hard to take two weeks off (or at least it was before I went to 48/96 schedule... I might try again soon, since there's one three hours away in Roswell).
Thanks everyone. I think I'll go with the general consensus of testing for my FP-C. I might test for CCP-C later on for grins later on too.

 

[STXmedic]

That's how it is around here, too. It's not a requirement to get hired, but you'll have to get it within a year of being hired. However, like WTE and Ak said, having it already provides a pretty good leg up against those applicant that they would have to push through after hiring.

 

[WTEngel]

I haven't seen it as a hiring requirement anywhere around here either, but...

Flight services are generally inundated with applications. Every Tom, **** and Harry wants to fly for whatever reason...and few of the applicants are actually qualified.

When the hiring manager looks through the apps for people they want to invite in for a second look, I can promise you FP-C is probably at the top of of their list nearly 95% of the time. It is a major foot in the door.

If you don't have FP-C when you apply, you are competing with all the other applicants. If you do have it already, you are in a very small pool, and have already accomplished one of the hardest parts of the process, which is standing out for a second look.

It also demonstrates a pretty sharp knowledge bank on your part. The FP-C exam is one of the few alphabet soup certs that is still legit in my opinion. Before everyone jumps on me and says that there are still other good certs out there...I'm not bashing them all. I'm just saying it is one of the few remaining that hasn't been watered down and still remains pretty exclusive. I think there are something like 2200 total now. I am 1756 and Kyle is just under 2000, and he got his a year or two back...this isn't the type of test that people just study for a weekend and pass, which is why flight services still look highly upon it.

 

[TransportJockey]

I haven't seen it as a hiring requirement anywhere around here either, but...

Flight services are generally inundated with applications. Every Tom, **** and Harry wants to fly for whatever reason...and few of the applicants are actually qualified.

When the hiring manager looks through the apps for people they want to invite in for a second look, I can promise you FP-C is probably at the top of of their list nearly 95% of the time. It is a major foot in the door.

If you don't have FP-C when you apply, you are competing with all the other applicants. If you do have it already, you are in a very small pool, and have already accomplished one of the hardest parts of the process, which is standing out for a second look.

It also demonstrates a pretty sharp knowledge bank on your part. The FP-C exam is one of the few alphabet soup certs that is still legit in my opinion. Before everyone jumps on me and says that there are still other good certs out there...I'm not bashing them all. I'm just saying it is one of the few remaining that hasn't been watered down and still remains pretty exclusive. I think there are something like 2200 total now. I am 1756 and Kyle is just under 2000, and he got his a year or two back...this isn't the type of test that people just study for a weekend and pass, which is why flight services still look highly upon it.

Thanks man. That does help. And I have heard that it's the hardest test that a medic can take. So far before even attempting it I've done the Creighton University CCP program (Mostly online w/ a pratical and clinical portion) and been going over Wingfield's stuff. I want to make sure my knowledge base is very much equal to the task... plus I'm a nerd like that and I've been doing it out of pocket and on my own time lol

 

[tacitblue]

So I am about ready to take one of the certifying tests and was wondering on people's opinions about the two different ones. I am doing some ground CCT when I pull some shifts in the city, along with a year and a half as a lead medic I a very busy rural 911 system with two years as a lead intermediate before that. My goal is flight eventually, either fixed wing or rotor, but I don't know if having my FP-C prior to applying will hurt me or not. I've heard stories or it hurting and it helping.
Any ideas?

My understanding is that they are equivalent on most accounts except for flight physiology in the FP-C.

 

[ExpatMedic0]

If you look at both the UMBC CCEMT-P and the BCCTPC FP-C resources on there websites, you will see in theory, that the UMBC is a foundation training course for people entering the critical care field whilst the FP-C is a difficult test designed for seasoned providers who have been working in critical care for several years.
Do not quote me on this, but I think the CCP-C draws from the same test bank as the FP-C from my understanding. The only difference being the CCP-C excludes flight ops/physiology. I believe it gives you more of the other questions to make up for that section being excluded. My friend (WT remember AJ?) took both the CCP-C and FP-C, failed the CCP-C but passed the FP-C lol. Go figure...

However, with no real national standards for this stuff and no rock solid rules, the same "Tom, ****, and Hairy's, that WT mentioned can take both of these things right out of paramedic school and ignore the recommendations, because that is all they are... recommendations. I also agree with AKF that from what I have seen, many reputable HEMS places recommended both the CCEMT-P and FP-C certifications. Even CAMTS using words like "recommends" instead of "required". There is also currently no national standard requirements for CME hours in critical care transport, only lots of "recommendations".

I just started getting into all this CCT stuff, so take what I say with a grain of salt, its just my understanding of things so far. I am taking my CCEMT-P at UMBC in a couple weeks. I am sure the guys here with CCT experience can be more helpful, I am just giving my 2 cents.

 

[Carlos Danger]

I used to interview a lot of potential flight paramedics who had no previous flight experience.

What I found was that those who had FP-C were usually no more knowledgeable than those who didn't, yet were almost always significantly more cocky. Almost as a rule, they would show up thinking they were owed a position.

I don't think I ever offered a job to someone who had no flight experience, but did have their FP-C.

It is a requirement with most reputable flight companies.

This is absolutely false.

I have seen very few programs that required FP-C of non-experienced candidates. And I can name many "reputable" programs that do not require FP-C.

 

[akflightmedic]

I did not say those with FP-C were more knowledgeable however it does demonstrate a level of commitment above other candidates and elevates one higher in the selection process.

I have not observed any extra or over cockiness as a result of this certificate.

I also did not say "all" reputable companies, I said "most" reputable companies require this cert in addition to the other alphabet soup and many years experience.

It is and always has been a competitive market to enter and anything you can do to improve your overall knowledge, education, exposure to higher skills, should be pursued if you want to achieve your goal.

Anyone who frowns on the above or implies it is not necessary should be avoided as they are doing you no favors.

 

[Carlos Danger]

I said "most" reputable companies require this cert

I know that is what you said, and it is a patently false statement.

I assure you that the vast majority of programs do not require it of new hires.

There may be a few out there that do, but they are a small minority.

 

[akflightmedic]

I know that is what you said, and it is a patently false statement.

I assure you that the vast majority of programs do not require it of new hires.

There may be a few out there that do, but they are a small minority.

And I will take the counter position and we will agree to disagree...unless you are just trying to argue semantics.

Because YOU are the one who inserted/implied that I said it was required of new hires. That is not what I said. I said most reputable companies require it, which they do. If you do not have it beforehand they require it within 6 months to a year.

Exceptionally competitive programs will require it of new hires as to increase the talent in their hiring pool.

And I am still unsure why you seem to be against it, especially as a current or past hiring authority. Who frowns on more education?

 

[TransportJockey]

If you look at both the UMBC CCEMT-P and the BCCTPC FP-C resources on there websites, you will see in theory, that the UMBC is a foundation training course for people entering the critical care field whilst the FP-C is a difficult test designed for seasoned providers who have been working in critical care for several years.
Do not quote me on this, but I think the CCP-C draws from the same test bank as the FP-C from my understanding. The only difference being the CCP-C excludes flight ops/physiology. I believe it gives you more of the other questions to make up for that section being excluded. My friend (WT remember AJ?) took both the CCP-C and FP-C, failed the CCP-C but passed the FP-C lol. Go figure...

However, with no real national standards for this stuff and no rock solid rules, the same "Tom, ****, and Hairy's, that WT mentioned can take both of these things right out of paramedic school and ignore the recommendations, because that is all they are... recommendations. I also agree with AKF that from what I have seen, many reputable HEMS places recommended both the CCEMT-P and FP-C certifications. Even CAMTS using words like "recommends" instead of "required". There is also currently no national standard requirements for CME hours in critical care transport, only lots of "recommendations".

I just started getting into all this CCT stuff, so take what I say with a grain of salt, its just my understanding of things so far. I am taking my CCEMT-P at UMBC in a couple weeks. I am sure the guys here with CCT experience can be more helpful, I am just giving my 2 cents.

I'm jealous you get to do the CCEMT-P at UMBC... I wish I could have taken it at this point, but I couldn't take the time off all at once. That's why I did the CCP program through CReighton. IT's a semester long mostly online program and actually is rather good. Good luck man. I'm still finding out the ins and outs (obviously) of CCT, and it's a convoluted world to be sure lol.
Good luck to ya

 

[ExpatMedic0]

I'm jealous you get to do the CCEMT-P at UMBC... I wish I could have taken it at this point, but I couldn't take the time off all at once. That's why I did the CCP program through CReighton. IT's a semester long mostly online program and actually is rather good. Good luck man. I'm still finding out the ins and outs (obviously) of CCT, and it's a convoluted world to be sure lol.
Good luck to ya

haha ya it is a whole other world of confusion, I am still figuring it out. I plan on posting a detailed thread regarding my experience and opinion of the UMBC with the CCEMT-P after I am done. Stay tuned end of July for the details. I will probably post under the "education and training" part of the forum once I have completed the class. Its a long flight to Baltimore, so at least I get some last minute study time!

 

[Carlos Danger]

duplicate

 

[Carlos Danger]

And I am still unsure why you seem to be against it, especially as a current or past hiring authority. Who frowns on more education?

Why do you assume I frown on more education? Just because I disagree with you on the value of a given credential?

I am very much a supporter of education. What I am not in favor of is "certifications" that imply a competency which very often doesn't exist.

To me, the FP-C is yet another example of paramedicine using a "quick fix" to try to compensate for a major deficit in education. The fact that it can be easily obtained without any experience or real training makes it worthless, and cheapens the meaning of it for those who are expert flight paramedics.

 

[akflightmedic]

Neither AEL or LN require FP-C of new hires, and combined they make up a large majority of the community-based HEMS operations in the US.

In addition to them, I could name several dozen hospital based programs - many which are quite reputable and competitive to get into, I might add - that I am familiar with that I know don't require FP-C of their new hires.



No. I never "inserted/implied" that you said it was required of new hires.

Re-read what you wrote that I was replying to:



And exactly what my response was:



So where did I accuse you of saying that "every" program required it?

If they are "non experienced" would that not make them a new hire?