Aurora FD for the win

SandpitMedic

SandpitMedic

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Omg... So what.

That's likely the tamest open mic **** talking I've ever heard.

Make it a hot button issue like - dare I say - "sexual harassment" and everyone gets all worked up.

Someone got their feelings hurt? Awwwwwww. Suck it up and drive on.
 
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escapedcaliFF

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That's nothing. Obviously the female EMT felt she could possibly get a lawsuit and contacted the media. Once it blows over she will probably be embarrassed and humiliated into going to a different agency.
 
Tigger

Tigger

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SandpitMedic said:
Omg... So what.

That's likely the tamest open mic **** talking I've ever heard.

Make it a hot button issue like - dare I say - "sexual harassment" and everyone gets all worked up.

Someone got their feelings hurt? Awwwwwww. Suck it up and drive on.
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That's definitely the right attitude to have over sexual harassment.
 
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escapedcaliFF

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Political correctness is running wild in this country. I remember when the army started pushing EO and mandatory sexual harrasment classes what a joke. So what a joke was made but do you honestly think he meant harm??
 
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escapedcaliFF

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Also if she has that reputation obviously a liuetant making a joke about it is not doing any harm to her image in that department.
 
Tigger

Tigger

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Reputation not withstanding, an officer in a leadership position should not be making such comments period.
 
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escapedcaliFF

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LACoGurneyjockey said:
So then where is the line, mr. all knowing Firefighter?
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First off I'm not longer a FF cause of medical reasons.
Oh he was deffiently on the line but not yet over it. He meant it as a joke that was reserved for his engine only and made a mistake. Fire departments are very close knit group of guys. Everyone on an engine is like a family. The guys at your station on another engine are like your extended family however you know you all have each other's best interest at heart. I have been the subject of someone dropping in on a conversation I was having with my guys and this outside person felt it was over the line and made a big stink about it. My guys had no issue with it what so ever cause we where all like brothers and command thought it was not over the line. While a Lt. saying those things might not send the best message to those under him its a far cry from anything totally out of control. I dont think his career should be at risk cause of a mistake. The issue I have is now a days someone says something they don't like and first thing they do is run to command or their EO rep. Careers are flushed down the drain due to political correctness and outside pressure. The media will always blow stuff out of proportion so I take this story with a grain of salt. This story is far from why they put sexual harrasment standards in place.
 
Tigger

Tigger

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escapedcaliFF said:
First off I'm not longer a FF cause of medical reasons.
Oh he was deffiently on the line but not yet over it. He meant it as a joke that was reserved for his engine only and made a mistake. Fire departments are very close knit group of guys. Everyone on an engine is like a family. The guys at your station on another engine are like your extended family however you know you all have each other's best interest at heart. I have been the subject of someone dropping in on a conversation I was having with my guys and this outside person felt it was over the line and made a big stink about it. My guys had no issue with it what so ever cause we where all like brothers and command thought it was not over the line. While a Lt. saying those things might not send the best message to those under him its a far cry from anything totally out of control. I dont think his career should be at risk cause of a mistake. The issue I have is now a days someone says something they don't like and first thing they do is run to command or their EO rep. Careers are flushed down the drain due to political correctness and outside pressure. The media will always blow stuff out of proportion so I take this story with a grain of salt. This story is far from why they put sexual harrasment standards in place.
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Thanks for the explanation on how tight knit fire crews are. You know that EMS often has that as well, right? We aren't just a bunch of soul sucking ambulance people.

If an individual's comments contribute to a hostile work place, that needs to be dealt with.
 
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escapedcaliFF

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Tigger said:
Thanks for the explanation on how tight knit fire crews are. You know that EMS often has that as well, right? We aren't just a bunch of soul sucking ambulance people.

If an individual's comments contribute to a hostile work place, that needs to be dealt with.
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Yeah I know that as I work on an ambulance now. I am no longer a FF due to medical reasons.
 
Tigger

Tigger

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I saw that. Nonetheless I find it tiresome how everytime something like that happens that FFs feel the need to justify such behavior with "boys club" excuse, complete with the lecture on "the brotherhood."
 
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escapedcaliFF

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Tigger said:
I saw that. Nonetheless I find it tiresome how everytime something like that happens that FFs feel the need to justify such behavior with "boys club" excuse, complete with the lecture on "the brotherhood."
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I didn't mean it that way. I'm just trying to make a point to people who might not know. Firefighting and EMS is still very much a boys club still. I have given the lecture to a EMT we had that was a female who felt she was left out and I spent time trying to make her feel welcomed. She understood things but always felt I was the only one she could talk to. She finally opened up a bit and got along with all the guys but still she would always come to me about how she felt left out and complain about guys making inappropriate jokes. Eventually she opened up and became more foul mouthed than a sailor. She developed that thick skin and when someone would make a joke directed at her she would dish it back ten fold. It can be a stressful job to begin with so a messed up foul mouth sense of humor is really the last thing people should be worried about. I have no problem with woman in FDs and EMS as long as they can do their job. Only issue I have is when woman use their gender as an excuse or think the same standards don't apply to them.
 
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EMTinCT

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It doesn't matter if this is "tame" or is it's reserved for his engine company or whatever. It's still sexual harassment, it's totally unprofessional, and someone in a senior leadership position needs to never, ever say such things. The best thing he can do now is profusely apologize, go through remedial education in sexual harassment and appropriate workplace behavior, draft new guidelines on sexual harassment, and be the model for future behavior. If he does anything less than he is simply perpetuating the "good old boys club" model.
 
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Uclabruin103

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This isn't just a fire or ems thing. This is a culture thing. Every job you go to will have these issues. Just so happens ours can be recorded and public record. These were for sure over the line for a supervisor. No doubt about it.

In today's work place is no longer what you meant to say... but how others interpret what you say.
 
COmedic17

COmedic17

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I feel like anyone who works in CO really wouldn't expect anything less from Aurora FD.
 
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exodus

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SandpitMedic said:
Omg... So what.

That's likely the tamest open mic **** talking I've ever heard.

Make it a hot button issue like - dare I say - "sexual harassment" and everyone gets all worked up.

Someone got their feelings hurt? Awwwwwww. Suck it up and drive on.
Click to expand...

escapedcaliFF said:
That's nothing. Obviously the female EMT felt she could possibly get a lawsuit and contacted the media. Once it blows over she will probably be embarrassed and humiliated into going to a different agency.
Click to expand...

escapedcaliFF said:
Political correctness is running wild in this country. I remember when the army started pushing EO and mandatory sexual harrasment classes what a joke. So what a joke was made but do you honestly think he meant harm??
Click to expand...

escapedcaliFF said:
Also if she has that reputation obviously a liuetant making a joke about it is not doing any harm to her image in that department.
Click to expand...

All of the opinions are pretty irrelevant here. It does not matter that she got her feelings hurt, it does not matter that he wasn't being PC. What matters is that the Lt who is in a leadership and supervisory position harassed another employee. It does not matter that it was not meant to be public, it was still harassment.

While the privateness or the severity should play a role in how hard the punishment is, it shouldn't not play a role in whether or not the Lt IS punished. It is undeniable that he broke harassment OGL's and should be punished.
 
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triemal04

Forum Deputy Chief
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exodus said:
All of the opinions are pretty irrelevant here.
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But they aren't, that's the thing, and something that people forget when this rather broad topic comes up. While the Lt got caught saying something that most would admit was innapropriate to one extent or another, and does qualify for some discipline to one extent or another, the feeling that people, or this country in general, has gone overboard on being PC is justified.

You will never, ever EVER make everyone happy with what is said, and you will ALWAYS be able to find someone that is offended by something you say each time you open your mouth. While the above situation isn't the best example, there does come a point when we, as people, a profession, and a country just have to shrug and say "oh well, that's just to bad that your feelings got hurt," and move on. Making a big deal out of what is, more often than not, piddly crap, trying to please everyone, and being so terrified of offending anyone is so flippin' counterproductive.

Look...I just did it myself...:D
 
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