From EMT-B to Paramedic

[Iancook]

I finished my EMT-B training and am now going to sit for my cert test. Since i have the time and money to do it right, so i have continued on with the education toward a Paramedicine A.S. degree. Is this wise, have any of you gone right from emt school to medic before getting a job out there, or while starting one? Thanks any input would be great.

Ian
Orlando, FL

[Chimpie]

Welcome to EMTLife!!!

You'll hear both sides of the argument here. Some say go straight into Medic school. Some will say wait till you get 6 months to a year of road experience then hit Medic school.

I'll let them give you the reasons.

Chimp

[Phridae]

I don't think going onto medic school right away is a very wise decision. Experiece is really the key to success this field. I really think you should get on a squad or work for a company before you proceed. What the book says and how its done on the stree are sometimes to completely different things.

[DT4EMS]

I have to agree with Phridae. It used to be mandatoy that you had to be a working EMT for 1 year before you could apply to medic school.

Now things have changed with "Pipe Line Paramedicine". I have met a few that were able to make it after going straight through, but the truth is, they receive little respect, at first, from the EMTs' that have been doing it a while.

As a medic, you are suppoesed to be the "Team Leader". It is pretty difficult to lead if you are still learning your job.

I found having experience prior to medic school made me more prepared for the classes. It also helped me treat my partners as "partners" and respect them more because I knew what they were going through as EMT's.

[MMiz]

First, Welcome to the forum!

I agree with the notion that a medic should have road experience prior to being allowed into medic school. That said, you're going to have an advantage of having the basics fresh in your mind from Basic school as you go on to the next level.

There are countless times I wish I remembered something I learned in EMT school. I was so full of knowledge back then... those were the days. It's not bad having to whip out the quick-flip guide or read a book after a shift, but having fresh knowledge was fun and exciting.

Good luck!

[KEVD18]

the best reason for not doing it that way is this

you get you medic ticket. you havent spent a day in the street, shoirt of some ride time and what not. you may never have hand to actually board someone in a real life situation. youve never tried to get Accurate vitals while your partner is coding throught the cuty. youve basically had little to no real time pt contact, AND NOW YOU WANT TO RUN AL INTERVENTIONS???????????

you need time to get the basic of working a truck in the street down flat before you move on to the high speed low drag world of the paragod. you really need to have a firm foundation to build up from. maybe you can get away with working as a basic during -p school but you need to be rock solid in you basic skills before getting into medic stuff.

thats my humble opinion. this is just one man talking. your resultsa may differ and your gas mileage may vary. as seen on tv, no refunds returns or exhanges.

[bloorozez]

Originally posted by Phridae@Aug 9 2005, 02:27 PM
I don't think going onto medic school right away is a very wise decision. Experiece is really the key to success this field. I really think you should get on a squad or work for a company before you proceed. What the book says and how its done on the stree are sometimes to completely different things.
i agree -- i was told that we cannot apply for medic school even before a year after our EMT-B and experience.

[CanuckEMT]

I don't believe there is any special time that you should spend in the field prior to applying for medic school. It depends on two things: 1 - how much experiance you attain. Eg: you get a job casual with a service and in 1 year work maybe 3 months worth of total time. Or you get on with a service full-time and run 6 to 8 calls a day. The difference in actual time to gain the experiance needed is vastly different.

2 - How comfortable you are with your baisc skills. You shoudl be very comfortable running a call and have mastery of your BLS skills before you even entertain the idea of becoming a medic. BLS always before ALS.

I have been in the field for 2 1/2 years. I am now confident enough with my BLS skills ( we have more here in Canada than down there) to apply for medic school. I have been doing some pre-study as well and let me tell you the things I have learned in that time from other partners and Doc's sure are making the studying part easier.

[Iancook]

Well, thanks for the welcome to the board. I just got on with an ambulance company in one of the counties around me, so I guess I will be working with them. See my deal is that I got a scholarship and as soon as i drop below full-time status at school, the scholarship disappears. So I would love to entertain the idea of a company letting get that experience then go to medic, but i also don't want to waste a scholarship. I guess it's my own rock and a hard place situation. medic school down here is about a year and a half, if working while atending school, could I be able to do both and end up in the same place, just sooner, as a -p and the experience? I guess I just really felt at home with the BLS skills and really wanted to get those ALS skills, just so i'm not as surprised by situations that may arise, and have more treatment options.

Thanks again for all the input....

Ian
Orlando, fl

[CanuckEMT]

With working and going to school it depends on your program scedule. I am taking what is refered to here as an " outreach " program. The scedule is one week on ( mon- fri) and one week off to work with my service. I will need the cooperation of my coworkers to exchange some shifts so I can still work. It is going to be rough, as I have spoken to some people that have already taken the program, but in the end I believe it is worth it.

And to tell you the truth I woukldn't want to let that scolarship disappear either as our medic costs around 22,000.00 by the time you are finished.

[SafetyPro]

Well, out here, the state regulations require 6 months minimum at the BLS level before you can go to medic school. Some of the medic schools have gotten even more stringent and require a full year.

[Cap'nPanic]

Ok I may be talking out of my arse here but I will say what I can.

As greenie, I definitely think it is a wonderful idea to require 1 yr exp. BEFORE enrolling in ALS courses. Experience is a good educator, but at the same time should not replace what you learn in the classroom.

As of right now Im getting prepared to start as a N/S EMT at an industrial facility. I plan on getting some truck time by volunteering for the local rescue squad. Hopefully I can add experience to what Ive learned in the classroom before I continue my education to the paramedic level.

I hope this puts another view on things.

-Cap'nPanic

[ffemt8978]

My $.02 worth, anyone got change for a nickel?

I do believe that having at LEAST one year of experience should be a requirement before moving on to paramedic, but I wouldn't waste the opprotunity the scholarship provides you. I say go for it, just make sure that you have a really good handle on your BLS skills.

[Flight-LP]

Work part-time for experience and continue with your education. By all means, if you have a "free ride" with a scholorship, use it. Also consider some classes outside of EMS, i.e. A-P, microbiology, english, speech, technical writing, the list goes on and on. regardless of your decision, I wish you the best...............

[Wingnut]

Personally I wouldn't. I have a free ride for my AS degree as well and was planning the same. I decided at last minute to change it to an RN degree instead of EMS. I'm personally not comfortable running a call and being the one in charge yet. But that's only me.

I know a few people who started out as medics and are damn good at it. They did have to prove themselves, but if your comfortable with what you're doing and feel you can handle it, go for it.

Best of luck to you!!! :D

[Firechic]

Hi Iancook! I guess I'm in the minority here with my experience. I went to paramedic school a couple of months out of EMT-B school. I did not have any problems or experience any prejudice/lack of respect due to not spending a year as a basic.
Do what you feel is right for you. Personally, I would not sacrifice the scholarship.
On the "pro" side of starting right away.....school is school and real life/ experience is just that. Sometimes people develop bad habits or do not perform skills according to the perfect "textbook" way. That way is what is tested in schools and that is what you need to know to pass.
There's my buck fifty.....best wishes to your future!! :)

[MMiz]

There was a great article in JEMS this month on this exact topic. The guy made a GREAT point about why it was important to have road experience first. Being a good Medic isn't just about knowing the drugs and what you're doing, but also the confidence you have while doing it. Confidence only comes with experience, and there's nothing worse than an insecure Medic.

As an insecure EMT I couldn't agree more. The single greatest thing holding me back as being a great EMT is probably my lack of experience. When I had to run a call solo at 30,000 feet when I was alone I practically crapped my pants. I went back and forth from treating an MI to treating a stroke. Fortunately both included oxygen and we didn't push any drugs.

Experience is what makes a good Medic :)

[TTLWHKR]

For me it was four years; 16-18; and then 18-20 while I was in school for it. I went to a two year tech school.

[Jon]

Originally posted by TTLWHKR@Aug 12 2005, 11:07 PM
For me it was four years; 16-18; and then 18-20 while I was in school for it. I went to a two year tech school.
Hey.... I guess I really AM TTLWHKR Jr.

Same thing for me.

If you have the free ride and can get in the program, by all means, go for it... my training was over $10,000 out of my pocket...not counting gas and train fare or food, or time lost from work....

Just be warned... you will have to work your butt off in school, and it is even worse if you are trying to work full time...

Jon

[runindash05]

Ian...Hey from orlando here too. You say that your working for a county here. Which county? Have my RMA interview this Wed. So you must be a FF too if working for county, unless it's Polk?

Brandon

[Iancook]

I'm going to be working with a private ambulance company in Volusia County. Hopefully this will be the way to apply the knowledge as I gain that needed experience. What's funny is that after talking to so many and everyone saying how much harder it will be, I still can wait to get into medic school. Anyone have any good tips for the up coming?

[Cap'nPanic]

Talk to your partner and ask him/her if they would be willing to show you techniques and new ALS assist skills that would beneficial as an ALS student. If you feel overwhelmed let your partner know. They have been where you are now and will likely understand the new EMT jitters. With time you'll become quite comfortable with your skills and working with your pts.

-Cap'n

[Nikki320]

So heres my .02 If you can get the experience first. Definitely. As everyone else has already said BLS before ALS. With that being said i have never worked as an EMT and am in paramedic school. The reason i did that was because 1. my dad is paying for it and 2. i thought i was going to have a job the whole time i was in medic school. Unfortunately once i started medic school (and my dad had already started paying), i was hired but then told that i could not work for them unless i could do their training. Well at my medic school if you miss more than 3 days of class you are kicked out, and they wanted me to miss 4. Needless to say i couldn't take the job. As much as i know i should have the experience, i also know that i need to take advantage of my dad paying for the paramedic school. If i were to drop medic school and go get the job, my dad wouldn't pay for medic school again. SO, for me yea... It's going to be harder, definitely. I will probably work as an EMT-B once i get my paramedic license for atleast 6 monthes just to get the hang of everything and then i'll move up to paramedic. The thing is, there are some good paramedics out there who had absolutely no emt-b experience... Yes, they are rare and they have to prove themselves but they are out there and i plan on being one of them. SO, if you have the scholarship, i'd say do it. Unless ofcourse you can afford to pay for it later on in life. If possible get a job first and work while in medic school. So, i wish you all the best and hope whatever you chose works out for you.

[trauma1534]

Keep in mind, it's not about how fast you can get to the top, but what you learn on the way. We are trained to go out and save lives. Other people put thier complete trust in us and we need to be well rounded and the very best we can be at what we do. I do not agree with zero to hero in 2 years. I think you need atleast 2 years of good dedicated field time to even start to get comfortable with your skills as a BLS provider. Never forget, BLS before ALS. You have to always remember you BLS no matter what you do in the future.

I say this because I have ran across all types of providers in the 11 years I have been in EMS. The ones who do the zero to hero in 2 years are in my experience dangerous to run with. The believe they know all there is to know because they have been schooled, but you get them in the real world, they hardly know how to back board a patient, much less run a shift or be in charge of a scene, etc.

It may sound harsh, but I am going by what I have seen. There is nothing that makes me sicker than for a new, green medic who is so wet behind the ears to step up in the back of my truck and tell me that I am doing somthing wrong, when I have been doing it alot longer than he has and it works for me, it may not be the text book way, but experience teaches you more than you will ever learn in school.

;)

[Iancook]

Yea, that is the general idea i am getting from the much more experienced. So as i am already in school and paid for, is it possible to finish medic and then work as an EMT at first for a while? But, this would be a waste of training if possible. What about working in an ED for the time while in school to get that experience. I know a few guys that teach us work at a dept. and the hospital, they say it's a great way to get that comfort in working with the patients while doing and seeing alot of those skills.

[Firechic]

Once you're a paramedic, then you're no longer an EMT-B. You take on the responsibilities of being a paramedic.
If you have the opportunity and believe that it would help you, then work in an ED during school. My suggestion?? Make sure you concentrate on what you need to know for school. Experience will come with time.....I can assure you that even with all the volunteering or time spent in an ER, you will still not feel comfortable later. It takes time.....make the most out of all of your experiences..why rush it?? I admire your enthusiasm, but do what you need to do and take all advice with a grain of salt.
That's my buck fifty!! ;)

[TTLWHKR]

I feel a person should have 1 or 2 years as a Basic before taking a medic class. That way they know the ropes, and have some on the job training. So Paramedic isn't such a shocker.

[ECC]

I think BLS experience is invaluble...There are Paramedics who are VERY successful with a minimum of experience...but the vast majority I have observed going straight through to Paramedic have some serious deficiencies that are very hard to correct.

When I went to Paramedic School, NYC*EMS required 2 1/2 years of street experience (not just time with a card) before they would send you to the Academy.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

[TTLWHKR]

Originally posted by ECC@Oct 15 2005, 01:44 PM
I think BLS experience is invaluble...
I'm not saying that anyone is less trained weather they have street time or not, just that it helps.. a lot.

I meant street expirence, and what better way than to work ALS as a basic, sure they drive, but still gain valuable knowledge.. I like someone who is comfortable, and has a fair grasp on how things work. Gives time to work on bed side manner, and a little less with the cocky attitude that people seem to be bringing into EMS.

I had a new medic as a partner on a two medic crew, I drove when I felt it wasn't something that was interesting :P , I could hear him using his cocky attitude with the patients. Said to him if he kept it up, someone may ‘swing back’ at his comments. They never learn, by the end of the day a drunk clocked him square in the face. Little training in bed side manner could have prevented that. http://www.emtlife.com/style_images/1/icon12.gif

[ECC]

So, basically, we agreed? :o :unsure:

[TTLWHKR]

Originally posted by ECC@Oct 15 2005, 04:51 PM
So, basically, we agreed? :o :unsure:
Just don't tell anyone.

[ECC]

Wouldn't matter...they would not believe me anyway! :D

[TTLWHKR]

Originally posted by ECC@Oct 15 2005, 11:29 PM
Wouldn't matter...they would not believe me anyway! :D
I Disconcur.

I made that word up...